From: mzehner2000  <matt_zehner@p...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 0:18am
Subject: option for additional shortcuts (was 2 or 3 little things)

Quick thought about a possible pool of untapped shortcuts: DB5 uses 
numbers as shortcuts as well as letters (I think CESD's used /1 
thru /7 so far, at least).  Not very intuitive, obviously, but it 
could give yo a little breathing room; if it's an important enough 
function to a particular user, there's a lot of incentive to memorize!

HTH
Matt

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Oct 2002, kasmesa wrote:
> 
> > The firsts that come to mind are /R (seems to be prestty standard 
in 
> > Palm apps for Preferences), or else /P, or /F, or /L... but they 
are 
> > all taken by something useful! Of course some shortcuts seem to 
be 
> > useless (like the ones for Promote / Demote now that there are 
icons 
> > on the bottom bar), but I realise it's quite difficult to take 
_out_ 
> 
> 	Carefull; keyboard people will be mightily offended ;) 
(Shortcuts
> are for grafitti and for keyboards)
> 
> > /- (dash) could be one as it's not used yet, and is easy to 
trace. On 
> > the other hand you could by mistake do a /' '(space) which 
is "toggle 
> > checkbox", so...
> 
> 	Yep.
> 
> > hey, it doesn't really matter which letter or sign, as long as 
ther 
> > _is_ a shortcut... 
> 
> 	See my dilemma ;)
> 
> 	I'll revisit in awhile.
> 
> 		jeff

From: tljr_2000  <tlj1@c...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 4:29am
Subject: Re: 2.6 Beta 5 feedback

While I can appreciate the complexities, Jeff, I look forward to your 
investigation of this point.  It's one of the reasons I haven't 
really started using the desktop much.  But nonetheless, I'm still 
getting a lot of mileage out of the HH!

Todd


--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Oct 2002, Jacob Share wrote:
> 
> >   > They did. To seal the deal, I made some more changes on the 
desktop side of
> >   > Superlist and synchronized. This time, many of the items I 
had marked for
> >   > deletion (perhaps all) in the Desktop had not been deleted 
and target dates
> >   > that were modified were also not taken into account.
> > 
> >         A lot of linked to ToDo items?
> >   Yup - the items whose target dates were modified were the 
aforementioned linked ToDo items.
> 
> 	Something I will be investigating for Shadow 2.7 is the link
> versus sync relations; ie: A synchronization happens at sync time, 
and
> ToDo and DB link synchronization happens when you open a Shadow 
file. Thus
> it is possible that linked items can have some odd effects you may 
not
> expect.. ie: If you update an item on the desktop, its changes are 
sent to
> the handheld. But the ToDo item changes will then at list-open-time
> clobber the desktops changes.. so your handheld could show somethign
> different than the desktop, as a result of the ToDo link having
> precedence. This sort of thign can get vary complicated quickly as 
you can
> see.. so I'll be thinkign about it over the next while. Its 
something I
> forgot about, but that came up very recently in some support :/
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: tljr_2000  <tlj1@c...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 5:14am
Subject: Cut / Paste Error Message

Has anyone come across this ... I'm working in a list.  I cut an item 
from that list using the [C] in the upper right corner, and then I 
paste as child that item (again, using the [C]) somewhere else in the 
same list. FYI ... The item in question happens to have a link 
associated with it.  When I then tap on the link arrow (far right 
side of screen) and tap "Go to ToDo", I get the error 
message "MemoryMgr.c, Line:4365, NULL Handle".  I then have to do a 
soft reset.  When I come back to this list, the link for this 
particular item has been severed and I have to reset the link.  What 
gives?  I don't seem to encounter this problem if I just "drag-and-
drop".

Todd

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 5:37am
Subject: Re: Cut / Paste Error Message

Interesting, and a better question for Jeff, but it would seem cut and paste would be more likely to sever a link logically thinking, and drag and drop less likely.  To me, the solution you are getting would be what I would expect, but maybe that is not right.  Jeff...?
Kevin
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: tljr_2000 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Sunday, October 27, 2002 9:14 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Cut / Paste Error Message


  Has anyone come across this ... I'm working in a list.  I cut an item 
  from that list using the [C] in the upper right corner, and then I 
  paste as child that item (again, using the [C]) somewhere else in the 
  same list. FYI ... The item in question happens to have a link 
  associated with it.  When I then tap on the link arrow (far right 
  side of screen) and tap "Go to ToDo", I get the error 
  message "MemoryMgr.c, Line:4365, NULL Handle".  I then have to do a 
  soft reset.  When I come back to this list, the link for this 
  particular item has been severed and I have to reset the link.  What 
  gives?  I don't seem to encounter this problem if I just "drag-and-
  drop".

  Todd


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From: Rita  <rblanzan@i...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 1:43pm
Subject: Re: Cut / Paste Error Message

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "tljr_2000" <tlj1@c...> wrote:
> Has anyone come across this ... I'm working in a list.  I cut an 
item 
> from that list using the [C] in the upper right corner, and then I 
> paste as child that item (again, using the [C]) somewhere else in 
the 
> same list. FYI ... The item in question happens to have a link 
> associated with it.  When I then tap on the link arrow (far right 
> side of screen) and tap "Go to ToDo", I get the error 
> message "MemoryMgr.c, Line:4365, NULL Handle".  I then have to do 
a 
> soft reset.  When I come back to this list, the link for this 
> particular item has been severed and I have to reset the link.  
What 
> gives?  I don't seem to encounter this problem if I just "drag-and-
> drop".
> 
> Todd

Yes, me too, but it's rare :) (Jeff, I couldn't resist, I sat on my 
hands and everything)

Todd, see my message #7613 and Jeff's reply at #7618.

I couldn't reproduce the error and I haven't seen it since and I 
have since completed the item.

Rita

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 2:31pm
Subject: Re: Re: Filter feature request

On Sun, 27 Oct 2002, clifton_cc wrote:

> I hope it isn't too bad of form to respond to my own post, but ...
> 
> > The filter I really want is
> > 
> > (checked is false) AND
> > ( (target date is present AND target <= today) OR
> >   (start date is present AND start <= today) )
> > 
> > But I can't write that with the current system of OR groups.
> 
> If we had 4 OR groups instead of 3, then I could write this filter as:
> 
> (checked is false) AND
> (target date is present OR start date is present) AND
> (target date is present OR start <= today) AND
> (target <= today OR start date is present) AND
> (target <= today OR start <= today)

	I can perhaps add more filter groups if needed.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 2:33pm
Subject: Re: Cut / Paste Error Message

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, tljr_2000 wrote:

> Has anyone come across this ... I'm working in a list.  I cut an item
> from that list using the [C] in the upper right corner, and then I
> paste as child that item (again, using the [C]) somewhere else in the
> same list. FYI ... The item in question happens to have a link
> associated with it.  When I then tap on the link arrow (far right side
> of screen) and tap "Go to ToDo", I get the error message "MemoryMgr.c,
> Line:4365, NULL Handle".  I then have to do a soft reset.  When I come
> back to this list, the link for this particular item has been severed
> and I have to reset the link.  What gives?  I don't seem to encounter
> this problem if I just "drag-and- drop".

	For debug sake, try doing it, and try doing it after cleaing the
clipboard. When you do a "paste", the original item is still in the
clipboard, so it is possible that when you do the "goto", the two of the
items are fighting (ie: The one in the list, and the one in memory in the
clipboard). The clipboard item is supposed to let go of the link
gracefully when you exit Shadow, but perhaps it is still tied to the
pasted item.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 2:35pm
Subject: Re: [Shadow-desktop] Shadow 2.6 Beta 5 (Windows) Available!

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, Christian Gaertner wrote:

> So far no problems with Palm and desktop application. The latter still
> lacks at least some form of rudimentary filtering (like
> completed/uncompleted) and formatting.  But the Palm application is
> still best of the breed (IMHO).

	Baby steps; I wanted to get drag and drop in there, and othe forms
of item pushign around, and that required the conduit to be much more
intelligent. I also wanted the conduit to work on a large number of
desktops environment (where you sync at 5 stations, that sort of thing),
as well as improve it all around. So the last while was almost entirely
conduit focused. Now the conduit is stable, the goal is to get the Mac OSX
side to beta, and then I can focus on improving the desktops across the
board, with a new feature going in showing up in both Windows and Mac at
the same time. That makes my life a lot easier :)

	So things are coming together very nicely right now; Shadow 2.6
going out, a nice solid new platform for Windows. The Mac side is catching
up. The desktop is much easier to maintain and add featres to in the new
release, so I can grow things much easier without complications or the
like.

	So expect growth much faster now, anyway.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Frederick G. Turner  <fred@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 2:59pm
Subject: RE: Re: 2 or 3 little things

> > > > 	What do you need to go there often for?
> > > 
> > > Well... change auto-numbering, or enabling titlebar, enabling sync
> > > (hotsync takes too long if you enable all lists to get synced by 
> > > default), or sometime just checking the custom list options
(granted, 
> > > this one is now easily done with the view manager)
> > 
> > I've always found the lack of this shortcut somewhat odd, and 
> > frustrating. I definitely visit the list preferences often: I don't 
> > have my views configured very well, so I frequently have to go in to

> > enable a field that I need in a view, or to change numbering to 
> > bullets or vice versa, or something else...  It seems that this 
> > shortcut is a must.
> 
> 	Suggest a key :)

That's a real devilish tactic... I hadn't noticed you already had the
whole alphabet in there... :)

Looks like the available options are I, J, Y and Z. I'd go for
[shortcut] I, just for simplicity of the stroke... anyone have any
better preferences here?

Saludos,
Fred.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 2:59pm
Subject: Shadow 2.6 Released!

A posting in shadow-announce should arrive soon for those
subscribed. For those who aren't.. check the website!

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: gf_gollum  <gf_gollum@y...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 7:42pm
Subject: Re: Shadow 2.6 Released!

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 
> 	A posting in shadow-announce should arrive soon for those
> subscribed. For those who aren't.. check the website!

Damn - didn't get a chance to post my beta5 problems.. Here they are 
anyway
a) Uninstall of previous beta's including 5, cause Control Panel/ Add 
Remove programs to hang. (On NT, XP and W2k). Has to be terminated 
with end task.

b) Dates in the desktop are in US format. Not desktop locale or palm 
spec.. just plain old USA. If you MUST stick to a single date, please 
use OCT-28-2002, or 28-Oct-2002 and avoid using numbers. What does 
10/2/2003 mean to you?? (not what it means to me I'm sure)[Issue 
still in 2.6 release]

OK.. sorry its just too late
Graham

From: tsuchy  <tsuchy@y...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 8:06pm
Subject: Re: 2 or 3 little things

/Z could be a toggle for zoom if:

/Z with item selected zooms inside that level;
/Z with no item selected unzooms;

Tom!

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kasmesa" <samir.kasme@s...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 
> > > a shortcut on "Zoom inside level" would be great. It can only be 
> > > reached by Menu (also the 'v' button, but that's impractical 
> > > somehow... too many things in there). what about "/ Z" which is 
> not 
> > > used yet?
> > 
> > 	We'd need a shortcut for zoom out, too :/
> 
> Not so much with the current behaviour, ie unzoom automatically 
> before exiting. Usually you zoom into a sublevel cause you are only 
> interested in that part of your file for the time being, and 
> presumably for the whole "Shadow session". Next time it can be 
> different. So the "unzoom on exit" is a good thing.
> 
> 
> > > Also a shortcut for List Preferences would be very useful, this 
> > > command is actually used quite frequently (at least I do)
> > 
> > 	What do you need to go there often for?
> > 
> 
> Well... change auto-numbering, or enabling titlebar, enabling sync 
> (hotsync takes too long if you enable all lists to get synced by 
> default), or sometime just checking the custom list options (granted, 
> this one is now easily done with the view manager)
> 
> 
> > > reached: a good way would be a HW button within Shadow that would 
> > > open a specific list: 
> [...]
>  
> > 	Its possible; Recent Files is pretty good at its job. Taking 
> over
> > hardkeys is amazingly uncool (since maybe you want to go the 
> Datebook ;),
> > even when you set up a pref to enable it or disable it. You could 
> use any
> > of a number of Megawiki type hacks to jump to a specific file. I 
> coudl
> > build something in, to make table of contents type files more 
> useful, but
> > I'm not sure hardkeys aer the way to go?
> > 
> 
> I agree that taking over hardkey is pretty heavy, but a Megawiki-type 
> hack is only half as useful: you would have to put hyperlinks to 
> your "Inbox" list all over the place, wouldn't you? The idea is to be 
> able to jump to a specific file from _anywhere_ within SP
> 
> > 
> > 	Gotta run.. sorry for the quick reply!
> > 
> 
> you mean thank _you_ for such quick replies, your reactiveness is 
> amazing. Better quick and short replies than waiting for weeks for a 
> long reply. It's like your releases, better quick releases with fewer 
> changes than big releases once a year ;-)
> 
> Cheers
> Samir

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:00pm
Subject: Re: Re: Shadow 2.6 Released!

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, gf_gollum wrote:

> Damn - didn't get a chance to post my beta5 problems.. Here they are 
> anyway
> a) Uninstall of previous beta's including 5, cause Control Panel/ Add 
> Remove programs to hang. (On NT, XP and W2k). Has to be terminated 
> with end task.

	Whacky; I'll take a look, but not too much I can do. Yes, I am
looking for alternative installer packages as a remedy..

> b) Dates in the desktop are in US format. Not desktop locale or palm
> spec.. just plain old USA. If you MUST stick to a single date, please
> use OCT-28-2002, or 28-Oct-2002 and avoid using numbers. What does
> 10/2/2003 mean to you?? (not what it means to me I'm sure)[Issue still
> in 2.6 release]

	Date localization and such will be coming soon.

> OK.. sorry its just too late

	S'alright. Shadow is always evolving. Its not like this is the
last release or anything ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:05pm
Subject: Woowoo!

I just scored myself a Tungsten; if only I didn't have to wait a
couple hours to pick it up and then to watch it charge. Rest assurred
Shadow will be very OS5 friendly...

	Anyone who has an OS5 unit, consider joining shadow-test as I'll
need some OS5 Highres testers..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jacob Share  <jacob@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:13pm
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

Where'd you get it? Congrats

Jacob
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jeff Mitchell 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 11:05 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Woowoo!



        I just scored myself a Tungsten; if only I didn't have to wait a
  couple hours to pick it up and then to watch it charge. Rest assurred
  Shadow will be very OS5 friendly...

        Anyone who has an OS5 unit, consider joining shadow-test as I'll
  need some OS5 Highres testers..

              jeff

  --
  "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
  circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
  sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
  -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_


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From: Kenneth S. Rhee  <polymath@m...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:18pm
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

Congratulations!

I've been laying low working on my Sony OS5 device for the last few days.

I'm little peeved since some of my programs that I use daily do not work any more.

As far as shadow is concerned, it works fine until you check off mixed resolution option--the display then gets corrupted and can't read it (it cuts off half of the letters)

So, all the small fonts are GONE!
--
Kenneth S. Rhee, polymath@m... on 10/28/2002


On Mon, 28 Oct 2002 17:05:09 -0500 (EST), Jeff Mitchell wrote:

    I just scored myself a Tungsten; if only I didn't have to wait a
couple hours to pick it up and then to watch it charge. Rest assurred
Shadow will be very OS5 friendly...

    Anyone who has an OS5 unit, consider joining shadow-test as I'll
need some OS5 Highres testers..

        jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:27pm
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, Jacob Share wrote:

> Where'd you get it? Congrats

	Apparently they're all over the US (since Friday or Saturday). I'm
in Canada and they're not yet at FutureShop or Best Buy.. but they are at
Office Depot / Staples (same store here) for $799CAN (about $525US)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:30pm
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, Kenneth S. Rhee wrote:

> I've been laying low working on my Sony OS5 device for the last few days.

	Nice!

	How good is the battery life?

	Virtual grafitti good, but I'll live without it. I just saw a Palm
show downtown Toronto where they waved magic wands. Some of this stuff
will be just incredible if it catches on, but the games and applications
already available for these units are incredible. Bluetooth head to head
gaming and messaging and file transfers are just going to go insane...

> I'm little peeved since some of my programs that I use daily do not
> work any more.

	Which ones?

> As far as shadow is concerned, it works fine until you check off mixed
> resolution option--the display then gets corrupted and can't read it
> (it cuts off half of the letters)

	Using Font Bucket by any chance? (Who knows if that works...)

	It should work fine on the Clie.. its using the Sony highres API
:/ Checked your font settings?

	Good question though.. does the NX70 use the Clie highres API, or
Palm OS5 highres API, or both?

	I'll be building a Palm OS5 highres option within hours or days,
fear not ;) Watch for a shadow-test announcement in a day or two no
doubt. No way I'm sitting in "low density" mode any more than I have to ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Kenneth S. Rhee  <polymath@m...>
Date: Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:36pm
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

--
>
>    How good is the battery life?
>

It seems decent, but I can tell it's not going to be great when I use my Wi-Fi card.

>    Virtual grafitti good, but I'll live without it. I just saw a Palm
>show downtown Toronto where they waved magic wands. Some of this
>stuff will be just incredible if it catches on, but the games and
>applications already available for these units are incredible.
>Bluetooth head to head gaming and messaging and file transfers are
>just going to go insane...
>
VG makes a big difference for me since it adds more screen real estate.  I didn't think it mattered until I started using it.

>>I'm little peeved since some of my programs that I use daily do not
>>work any more.
>
>    Which ones?

Quite a few.  Including Quickword, Daynotez, Supernames.  These programs all worked under Palm simulator, but . . .
>
>>As far as shadow is concerned, it works fine until you check off
>>mixed resolution option--the display then gets corrupted and can't
>>read it (it cuts off half of the letters)
>
>    Using Font Bucket by any chance? (Who knows if that works...)
>

Yes, I'm using the latest FB that's compatible with OS5

>    It should work fine on the Clie.. its using the Sony highres API :/
>Checked your font settings?
>
>    Good question though.. does the NX70 use the Clie highres API, or
>Palm OS5 highres API, or both?
>

I don't know about both.  According to Sony, they followed the Palm convention for HR API.  All the HR programs that worked under older Sony do not work any more.  So, I guess it's not both.

>    I'll be building a Palm OS5 highres option within hours or days,
>fear not ;) Watch for a shadow-test announcement in a day or two no
>doubt. No way I'm sitting in "low density" mode any more than I have
>to ;)
GREAT!

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 1:07am
Subject: Re: Woowoo!

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, Kenneth S. Rhee wrote:

> >    How good is the battery life?
> 
> It seems decent, but I can tell it's not going to be great when I use my Wi-Fi card.

	WiFi? Bluetooth or 802.11? 802.11 is killer on power. Not a PDAs
fault. It seem sokay on battery life. Its a real shocker to give up
MegaLauncher for me.. someone better get a highres launcher out ASAP!

> VG makes a big difference for me since it adds more screen real
> estate.  I didn't think it mattered until I started using it.

	yeah. I enter a lot of text, so I dont' mind not having it.. but
then, never had it either ;)

> Quite a few.  Including Quickword, Daynotez, Supernames.  These
> programs all worked under Palm simulator, but . . .

	I bet all those will be updated ASAP. I'm surprised though. Shadow
works out of box (and its even a little naughty), so I'm surprised these
guys nogo :/

> >    Using Font Bucket by any chance? (Who knows if that works...)
> 
> Yes, I'm using the latest FB that's compatible with OS5

	Odd.

> >    It should work fine on the Clie.. its using the Sony highres API :/
> >Checked your font settings?
> >
> >    Good question though.. does the NX70 use the Clie highres API, or
> >Palm OS5 highres API, or both?
> 
> I don't know about both.  According to Sony, they followed the Palm
> convention for HR API.  All the HR programs that worked under older
> Sony do not work any more.  So, I guess it's not both.

	OKay, so its probably an extended Palm one then, to support VG. I
bet thats the problem.. it probably says "yes, I'm Sony Clie hifghres
extensions" so you can do virtual grafitti, but when you try highres Sony
API it gets borked. We probably need to figure out if its VG only, and
Palm highres. Whacky :/

	Soon enough. Please watch shadow-test so I can fix you up :)


> >    I'll be building a Palm OS5 highres option within hours or days,
> >fear not ;) Watch for a shadow-test announcement in a day or two no
> >doubt. No way I'm sitting in "low density" mode any more than I have
> >to ;)
> GREAT!

	You know me :) Sucker for punishment :P

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: CAH Cox  <charlepp@c...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 1:27am
Subject: DT cuttin' & pastin'

Jeff: this was an issue before the current betas, and it still remains: If I copy or cut items from an email (like sender's contact info) into an entry in a Shadow file on the DT, often when I try to open this file later I can't..the error references some unrecognized international characters, which aren't in there (at least not visible...these are US names and addresses) , but you have suggested the email may have some "junk" I can't see which is corrupting the Shadow file; However, I follow this procedure in other desktop apps, like DayNotez, and there is never a problem! Is this fixable in a future release?
Also, if you then open the raw .pdb on the DT to get your file back, and save it with as a Shadow DT file, with the .xml extension, the name still has the .htm extension, which needs to be manually corrected to *.xml. Why is that?
Having said that, I'm still on beta 4, so maybe I should try this again with beta 5?
Keep up the excellent improvements...
Chris
PS: Installed beta 5...same issues as above...


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 2:01am
Subject: Re: DT cuttin' & pastin'

On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, CAH Cox wrote:

> Jeff: this was an issue before the current betas, and it still
> remains: If I copy or cut items from an email (like sender's contact
> info) into an entry in a Shadow file on the DT, often when I try to
> open this file later I can't..the error references some unrecognized
> international characters, which aren't in there (at least not
> visible...these are US names and addresses) , but you have suggested
> the email may have some "junk" I can't see which is corrupting the
> Shadow file; However, I follow this procedure in other desktop apps,
> like DayNotez, and there is never a problem! Is this fixable in a
> future release?

	Which Desktop version do you have? You can paste right fromWord
and such no problem in desktop 1.2.5. Perhaps theres a problem if you're
using < and > in the text, but I think that too is handhled..

> Also, if you then open the raw .pdb on the DT to get your file back,
> and save it with as a Shadow DT file, with the .xml extension, the
> name still has the .htm extension, which needs to be manually
> corrected to *.xml. Why is that?

	Because of factors outside of my control.

> Having said that, I'm still on beta 4, so maybe I should try this
> again with beta 5?

	Or 2.6? :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: CAH Cox  <charlepp@c...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 1:06pm
Subject: Re: DT cuttin' & pastin'

DT is 1.2.5; I'm sure pasting from Word shouldn't present any problems: I'm pasting usually from an email message, which we both agree can have some hidden junk. The last time I got the error, I had pasted a name/address/phone from someone's email (I'm using Outlook Express 6) and then copied them into DayNotez desktop, and then copy and pasted into Shadow.
Is it possible that copying first into Word can "wash" the text so it's clean enough for Shadow not to choke on it? Obviously DayNotez didn't do the job...but DayNotez didn't choke on whatever might be hidden in that text, either...what's the feature in Shadow that would make it that sensitive to a couple of snippets of hidden text (if that's what the problem is)?
Yeah, it's 2.6...but beta 5!! How are you groovin on the new Palm? Did you get the keyboard model, or is that coming out later? I'd be curious how it stacks up to the Clie N70 series...
Chris
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jeff Mitchell 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Monday, October 28, 2002 9:01 PM
  Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] DT cuttin' & pastin'


  On Mon, 28 Oct 2002, CAH Cox wrote:

  > Jeff: this was an issue before the current betas, and it still
  > remains: If I copy or cut items from an email (like sender's contact
  > info) into an entry in a Shadow file on the DT, often when I try to
  > open this file later I can't..the error references some unrecognized
  > international characters, which aren't in there (at least not
  > visible...these are US names and addresses) , but you have suggested
  > the email may have some "junk" I can't see which is corrupting the
  > Shadow file; However, I follow this procedure in other desktop apps,
  > like DayNotez, and there is never a problem! Is this fixable in a
  > future release?

        Which Desktop version do you have? You can paste right fromWord
  and such no problem in desktop 1.2.5. Perhaps theres a problem if you're
  using < and > in the text, but I think that too is handhled..

  > Also, if you then open the raw .pdb on the DT to get your file back,
  > and save it with as a Shadow DT file, with the .xml extension, the
  > name still has the .htm extension, which needs to be manually
  > corrected to *.xml. Why is that?

        Because of factors outside of my control.

  > Having said that, I'm still on beta 4, so maybe I should try this
  > again with beta 5?

        Or 2.6? :)

              jeff

  --
  "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
  circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
  sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
  -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_


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From: kasmesa  <samir.kasme@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 3:17pm
Subject: Re: Rapid access to Shadow lists (Megawiki)

> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "vjornes" <vjornes@y...> wrote:
> > --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kasmesa" <samir.kasme@s...> wrote:
> > <snip>
> 
> > Id recommend mapping a button combo to call up the shadowplan 
> > you want with something like Easylaunch.  (If you want to 
> > specify a specific Shadow file you may need to try it in 
> > combination with Megawiki (also free) to call up the shadow you 
> want 
> > - use quiki).
> > 
> > Alternativly you may want to try using piki which is part of the 
> 


No need for any HW or SW shortcut within SP anymore, Megawiki can do 
that and much much more.... you were right, this little thing is 
really amazing!

Samir

From: radleyp2000  <pradley@r...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 3:50pm
Subject: New Shadow conduit

I just installed 2.6, only to find that the new conduit had installed 
itself twice in hotsync. How do I remove the conduit? Thanks for any 
help. PDR

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 4:05pm
Subject: Re: New Shadow conduit

This is "as designed" behavior. If you only want to see it once, reboot
your PC. That's what you get for being observant : ).


                                                                                                                   
                    "radleyp2000"                                                                                  
                    <pradley@r...        To:     shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com                                    
                    rose.com>            cc:                                                                       
                                         Subject:     [shadow-discuss] New Shadow conduit                          
                    10/29/2002                                                                                     
                    09:50 AM                                                                                       
                    Please                                                                                         
                    respond to                                                                                     
                    shadow-discus                                                                                  
                    s                                                                                              
                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                   




I just installed 2.6, only to find that the new conduit had installed
itself twice in hotsync. How do I remove the conduit? Thanks for any
help. PDR



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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 4:32pm
Subject: Re: New Shadow conduit

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, radleyp2000 wrote:

> I just installed 2.6, only to find that the new conduit had installed 
> itself twice in hotsync. How do I remove the conduit? Thanks for any 
> help. PDR

	Check the FAQ. This is supposed to happen, and the old conduit
will go away next time you restart Hotsync Manager or reboot. IT wont'
sync twice or anything, either, so no worries.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 4:15pm
Subject: Re: DT cuttin' & pastin'

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, CAH Cox wrote:

> DT is 1.2.5; I'm sure pasting from Word shouldn't present any
> problems: I'm pasting usually from an email message, which we both
> agree can have some hidden junk. The last time I got the error, I had
> pasted a name/address/phone from someone's email (I'm using Outlook
> Express 6) and then copied them into DayNotez desktop, and then copy
> and pasted into Shadow.

	Pasting into Shadow Desktop 1.2.5 strips out all the offensive
binary junk Windows likes to include, so it should work.

	Make a new test list, with like 2 or 3 dummy items.

	Then go to your email app, and copy somethign, and paste it into
the memo/note field in the desktop. 

	Then send me the XML file if you cannot open it, and I'll see
whats going on in the XML.

> Yeah, it's 2.6...but beta 5!! How are you groovin on the new Palm? Did

	2.6 is not beta5; they're close, but not identical :)

> you get the keyboard model, or is that coming out later? I'd be
> curious how it stacks up to the Clie N70 series...

	I picked up the Tungsten T (not the W which is the phone-like one
with the keyboard thingy on it).

	Being OS5 means losing Hacks which is a bit of a shocker (ie: I
live on PiDirect.. or did). Since OS5 is so new, theres a bucnh of apps I
suddenlly miss. MegaLauncher (highres on Cile) was my launcher for a long
long time.. but it doesn't yet work on OS5. So I'm stuck with SilverScreen
low rez (what I had before ML). It runs fast as a bat out of hell on the
Tungsten, but damn.. I hate Silverscreen :)

	Tungsten versus NX70 .. is complex. The Tungsten has a *gorgeous*
screen. Best I've ever seen on a handheld.. the white is actually white,
and it shows up great in light or dark. I've been using a Clie for awhile,
and those screens are nice, but the T whips them. The sound is excellent
etc. Highres yadda yadda. So the Tungsten has everythign the Clies can do,
and the same as the NX70.. exceptnig the virtual grafitti and built in
camera and clam keyboard. I dont' care about any of those things, nor do I
acre about mp3 or the like anyway.. I use a PAD for PDA work, not music
and casmera work.. I have a digital camera for that :)

	So the Tugnsten is quite nice; it is *very* fast. The Nx70 will be
faster I imagine, but fast is fast. The Tungsten seems to have a very good
battery life, while the XN will not. The older Clies were okay.. the N760C
was a great battery life for me, but the NR series is not godo enough
IMHO.

	I'm still learnign the unit, but so far.. I've beciome hooked
fast. Speed is everything :) Some main apps came over fine, while some
others broke.. but I expect updates soon. Handstory for instance better
fix soon or I'll go to Plucker or the like.. but I'm fond of Handstory. I
need a highres launcher, but I can get by. By the other apsp (like Shadow
;) run like crazy...

	Gotta run. If you want a review I can do one..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: George David R-G16477  <d.george@m...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 8:54pm
Subject: Desktop Feature Request

Just wondering if it would be possible to make the desktop act like the handheld with checkboxes next to the items and maybe even 'strike-out' when checked.
 
Also, in the first ShadowPlan desktop app that launches, could there be list of the different outlines there, instead of having to go thru the file menu?
 

Thanx! 
  
David George
IT System Engineer
Motorola ESG
Lawrenceville GA
770-338-3888 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Oct 29, 2002 9:05pm
Subject: Re: Desktop Feature Request

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, George David R-G16477 wrote:

> Just wondering if it would be possible to make the desktop act like
> the handheld with checkboxes next to the items and maybe even
> 'strike-out' when checked.

	In time. Lots of writing to get it to that point, since no desktop
OS provides that powerful a built in widget, so I'll be writing an all new
Shadow-like widget cross platform for all the desktops. But its very high
on my list.

> Also, in the first ShadowPlan desktop app that launches, could there
> be list of the different outlines there, instead of having to go thru
> the file menu?

	The button bar is a little faster than the menu, but good
idea. That coudl be a good use for the base window.. ie: I had intended it
to be a drag and drop anchor and for clipboard viewing, but a fast
launcher would be cool too. I'll meditate on it.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: mzehner2000  <matt_zehner@p...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 1:54am
Subject: mass promotion of children?

Looking for advice, and hoping I'm missing something obvious!  If 
not, Jeff, there may be some feature requests imbedded here. :)

Is there a quick way to promote all the children of an item to the 
parent's level? Or, alternatively, to demote a parent to its 
children's level, or delete/cut/move a parent without 
deleting/cutting/moving the children?

Here's my situation: I wanted to make Shadow my repository for 
Someday/Maybe items, instead of having them occupy a ToDo category.  
So I did an import of that category, which contained 200+ items.  
Naturally, Shadow split them up into 3 lists, each with a single 
parent called "Someday/Maybe" that contained many children.  In order 
to get them all back into one file, I selected the parent items in 2 
of the lists and used "Send Clip to File" into the third.  

Now I have a list with 3 siblings, each called "Someday/Maybe", each 
with many children.  Now I want to get rid of the 3 top-level 
siblings and be left with one big list of all the current children as 
top-level siblings.  What's an EASY way to do this for very long 
lists?  

I realize that I could click on each child in turn and use "Promote 
Item" (which, admittedly, is now made much quicker by the new 
desktop), or check every child and then use "Cut and Uncheck All 
Checked" and paste into the top level - but any solution that 
requires me to manually touch every item seems to me to be 
unacceptable, or at least very unsatisfactory when dealing with so 
many items.  

I see several ways to address this: a "Promote All Children" command 
or "Check All Children" command on the handheld would seem to me to 
be the quickest.  Alternatively (or additionally!), enabling 
selection of multiple items on the desktop could accomplish the same 
thing, as long as the promote/demote buttons worked on the 
selection.  I would suggest the Windows "standard" 
Select+Shift+Select for selecting a range of items and 
Select+Ctrl+Select for selecting non-adjacent items, but I'm 
certainly open to other options.

Thanks in advance for any advice (or new features) ;).

Matt

From: Steven Whatley  <swhatley@h...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 3:36am
Subject: v2.6 and hi-res

Hi Jeff,

I'm glad to see in the list of new features that HandEra 330 hi-res
support is coming.  Looking forward to that!  I'll be happy to beta test.

Thanks,
Steven

From: Anthony Schellenberg  <aschell@p...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 4:15am
Subject: Re: mass promotion of children?

Open list preferences and click the opt button.  There is an option there called 'suppress autocheck'  make sure this option is not selected.  Then in your list you should be able to just change your newly imported list into the checklist style so that everything has a checkbox, then checking the 3 parent items should cause all children to be checked.  Then go back to list preferences and turn that option on.  Then you can uncheck the parents and all the children stay checked

>desktop), or check every child and then use "Cut and Uncheck All 
>Checked" and paste into the top level - but any solution that 
>requires me to manually touch every item seems to me to be 
>unacceptable, or at least very unsatisfactory when dealing with so 
>many items.  
>


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From: mr_hank_01  <mr_hank_01@y...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 5:38am
Subject: DT to HH sync problem

I'm still on the beta 5.  Not sure if this is a problem or if I've 
not set some setting correctly.

With a file sync'ed, I made some edits on the DT copy (added a couple 
items, edited a couple items), then resync.  When I check the HH, I 
see:

1 - new items came across OK.
2 - in that section (parent on down) I just added to, ALL items are 
now checked as if completed.  (Actually, I suspected this was going 
to happen when I saw all items in the DT screen had the "Finished 
Date" filled in with today's date
3 - edited items - changes did not come across.

I looked at the sync options: HH overides DT, but that's IF there's a 
change on both files.  I only edited the DT file.

Desktop 1.2.5
HH 2.6.0
sync 1.0.0
Conduit 2.0.0
Palm m500

What am I forgetting to do?

Thanks - Andrew

From: Neal Cordle  <nhcordle@e...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 1:16pm
Subject: Re: mass promotion of children?

Matt,

I recently did pretty much exactly what you did (though on a smaller scale,
so I just promoted each item individually) and ran across a bug in the
conduit.  (I've passed the info on to Jeff and it's on his list of fixes).
It occurs only when you make the changes you described on the HH on a list
you are syncing to the DT.

IF you make the promotion changes on the HH AND then delete the original
parent BEFORE you sync with the DT, the promoted children will be deleted as
well. (of course they can be restored from backups, but that's another step
you don't want to take.)

Procedure to avoid this:
1.  Promote all children - I'll leave it up to you as to how :-)
2.  Sync with DT.
3.  Delete original parent - Someday/Maybe in your case

Interestingly, this does not occur if you make the changes on the DT, so
that's another work around.

Not trying to alarm anybody..... Just know this happened to me..... it's on
the list to be fixed........ Doesn't shake my confidence in a great tool!

Neal





----- Original Message -----
From: "mzehner2000" <matt_zehner@p...>
To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, October 29, 2002 8:54 PM
Subject: [shadow-discuss] mass promotion of children?


> Looking for advice, and hoping I'm missing something obvious!  If
> not, Jeff, there may be some feature requests imbedded here. :)
>
> Is there a quick way to promote all the children of an item to the
> parent's level? Or, alternatively, to demote a parent to its
> children's level, or delete/cut/move a parent without
> deleting/cutting/moving the children?
>
> Here's my situation: I wanted to make Shadow my repository for
> Someday/Maybe items, instead of having them occupy a ToDo category.
> So I did an import of that category, which contained 200+ items.
> Naturally, Shadow split them up into 3 lists, each with a single
> parent called "Someday/Maybe" that contained many children.  In order
> to get them all back into one file, I selected the parent items in 2
> of the lists and used "Send Clip to File" into the third.
>
> Now I have a list with 3 siblings, each called "Someday/Maybe", each
> with many children.  Now I want to get rid of the 3 top-level
> siblings and be left with one big list of all the current children as
> top-level siblings.  What's an EASY way to do this for very long
> lists?
>
> I realize that I could click on each child in turn and use "Promote
> Item" (which, admittedly, is now made much quicker by the new
> desktop), or check every child and then use "Cut and Uncheck All
> Checked" and paste into the top level - but any solution that
> requires me to manually touch every item seems to me to be
> unacceptable, or at least very unsatisfactory when dealing with so
> many items.
>
> I see several ways to address this: a "Promote All Children" command
> or "Check All Children" command on the handheld would seem to me to
> be the quickest.  Alternatively (or additionally!), enabling
> selection of multiple items on the desktop could accomplish the same
> thing, as long as the promote/demote buttons worked on the
> selection.  I would suggest the Windows "standard"
> Select+Shift+Select for selecting a range of items and
> Select+Ctrl+Select for selecting non-adjacent items, but I'm
> certainly open to other options.
>
> Thanks in advance for any advice (or new features) ;).
>
> Matt
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

From: tarasofsky  <Tarasofsky@t...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 3:09pm
Subject: syncing problems

I am having trouble syncing from the DT to the HH, with 2.6.  I sync 
between two computers, but I do not think that is playing a role here. 
 After I synced on the second computer, I changed something on the 
desktop.  I sync again, but that change does not appear on the HH. The 
hotsync option is set to syncronise.  As to whether there were changes 
on both sides, it was first set to HH overrides; I then selected keep 
items from both sides -- still no difference, although that should not 
be the issue since I only changed on the desktop.

Any ideas?

Just out of curiousity, how is it that Palm desktop syncs with no 
problems, on different computers, but syncing in other programs is so 
much more complex?  I am sure there is a good answer, but it is not 
obvious to this layman.

Richard

From: Chris  <chris@p...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 3:28pm
Subject: Re: syncing problems

On 30 Oct 2002 at 15:09, tarasofsky wrote:

> 
> Just out of curiousity, how is it that Palm desktop syncs with no 
> problems, on different computers, but syncing in other programs is so 
> much more complex?  I am sure there is a good answer, but it is not 
> obvious to this layman.
> 

Well for one the built in databases that Palm Desktop uses are actually rather 
simple. For each function there is only one file, and that file is pretty flat 
in it's structure (you don't have nested Contacts, you don't have nested ToDo's 
etc.).

Shadow however (as an example of a more complex sync situation) has multiple 
databases ... each containing (potentially) highly nested data. Elements can be 
moved hirearchically, created, destroyed, etc ... and this all needs to be 
tracked.

Also I don't think that the Palm Desktop is as swift as you may think, but 
rather the Data isn't as dynamic. How many times a day do you update your 
address book compared to your Shadow lists? I'm sure if you were adding and 
removing contacts at the rate of several a day ... in between syncing on 
different desktops ... that you would run into occasions where you'd end up 
loosing (or gaining unwanted) data. It's similar with Memo's, Todo's and 
Datebook entries (although these last two are much more dynamic ... but that's 
why people use programs like Dbk5 and Shadow ... )

-Chris

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 4:27pm
Subject: Re: syncing problems

And for those of you that sync with Palm Desktop, have you checked out the Agendus (or Action Names as i still prefer) desktop?  Very nice in my opinion, love the colors, abilities, and layout.  Standard is the one most will use.
Enjoy,
Kevin
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Chris 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, October 30, 2002 7:28 AM
  Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] syncing problems


  On 30 Oct 2002 at 15:09, tarasofsky wrote:

  > 
  > Just out of curiousity, how is it that Palm desktop syncs with no 
  > problems, on different computers, but syncing in other programs is so 
  > much more complex?  I am sure there is a good answer, but it is not 
  > obvious to this layman.
  > 

  Well for one the built in databases that Palm Desktop uses are actually rather 
  simple. For each function there is only one file, and that file is pretty flat 
  in it's structure (you don't have nested Contacts, you don't have nested ToDo's 
  etc.).

  Shadow however (as an example of a more complex sync situation) has multiple 
  databases ... each containing (potentially) highly nested data. Elements can be 
  moved hirearchically, created, destroyed, etc ... and this all needs to be 
  tracked.

  Also I don't think that the Palm Desktop is as swift as you may think, but 
  rather the Data isn't as dynamic. How many times a day do you update your 
  address book compared to your Shadow lists? I'm sure if you were adding and 
  removing contacts at the rate of several a day ... in between syncing on 
  different desktops ... that you would run into occasions where you'd end up 
  loosing (or gaining unwanted) data. It's similar with Memo's, Todo's and 
  Datebook entries (although these last two are much more dynamic ... but that's 
  why people use programs like Dbk5 and Shadow ... )

  -Chris

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From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 5:31pm
Subject: What to do with Tungsten 5-way Pad?

We've had one-handed operation of Shadow Plan for awhile (for
Clie's). Of course, thats all Sony specific stuff, and is jog-dial
oriented anyway. So how would we want the 5-way button to work?

	FYI: The five-way control is actually a 4-way "d-pad" with a
center button. Its a disc that you can push up, down, left, or right, or
push down in the middle. I imagine it will be good for gamers, especially
if it can sense two things at once and thus represent 8-direction ;)

	For the Clie's jog dial, we make it like this: Jog either moves
the selection hilight up or down one item, or pages up or down. It pages
the view if no item is selected, or moves the hilight if an item is
selected. If no item is selected, pushing the jog selects the topmost
visible item, while pushing th Back button unselects an item. Pushing the
back button while no item is selected takes you back to the file selecting
screen. Pushing the jog while an item is already selected opens the
Details window. While in the file selection screen, the jog lets you
scroll up and down the file listing, and pushing the jog opens the
selected file.

	Essentially on the Clie, using the jog and back buttons, you can
view any Shadow list on your handheld, with one hand.

	We could do similar things with the navigation control on the
Tungsten, perhaps even figure out a way to check items.

	Before you get goofy, I don't think I want to have a horizontal
icon bar of operations, with "push" picking one and left/right selecting
which one, and up/down selecting items. Thats too much work and would be
bloaty ;)

	However, using up/down to scroll the selection or view, and
left/right to select or unselect, sounds reasonable and would fit into the
existing jog dial code reasonably easily. We could use the push-button to
open details, or perhaps do checkbox toggling and leave the detail window
to the left/right action. So in effect we could use up/down just as with
jog dial, and use left/right to simulate the jog push and back button
push.. that leaves us with the center push button tobe something new, like
toggle checkbox.

	Any thoughts?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:11pm
Subject: Re: v2.6 and hi-res

On Tue, 29 Oct 2002, Steven Whatley wrote:

> I'm glad to see in the list of new features that HandEra 330 hi-res
> support is coming.  Looking forward to that!  I'll be happy to beta test.

	Keep bugging me, and early alphas and betas are always in
shadow-test before here.

	I wonder what Handera is up to; they never got the colour unit out
did they? Any newso n new b/w units? I want to know if they're still going
to be with us in a year or two.. they're too quiet. Thats a great unit
they've got, so I hope they're nto having problems :/

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: G. Edw. Learned  <learned@v...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:13pm
Subject: Re: What to do with Tungsten 5-way Pad?

How about left right for zoom/unzoom?

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:14pm
Subject: Re: DT to HH sync problem

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, mr_hank_01 wrote:

> I'm still on the beta 5.  Not sure if this is a problem or if I've 
> not set some setting correctly.
> 
> With a file sync'ed, I made some edits on the DT copy (added a couple 
> items, edited a couple items), then resync.  When I check the HH, I 
> see:
> 
> 1 - new items came across OK.
> 2 - in that section (parent on down) I just added to, ALL items are 
> now checked as if completed.  (Actually, I suspected this was going 
> to happen when I saw all items in the DT screen had the "Finished 
> Date" filled in with today's date

	That would suggest they were already checked when they got to the
desktop. Did you accidentally hit the Checkbox somewhere along the
line? (like on the parent, and thus checkign all the children?)

> 3 - edited items - changes did not come across.

	Are they linked to ToDo or Datebook? (ie: I so, then the linked
object becomes the master when "outside of Shadow", so you then have 3
sources of truth, with the external linked object takign precedence)
(Yeah, I need to think about this. Its getting complicated ;)

	Does this help?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:18pm
Subject: Re: syncing problems

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, tarasofsky wrote:

> I am having trouble syncing from the DT to the HH, with 2.6.  I sync
> between two computers, but I do not think that is playing a role here.
>  After I synced on the second computer, I changed something on the
> desktop.  I sync again, but that change does not appear on the HH. The
> hotsync option is set to syncronise.  As to whether there were changes
> on both sides, it was first set to HH overrides; I then selected keep
> items from both sides -- still no difference, although that should not
> be the issue since I only changed on the desktop.

	Is 2.6 installed on both desktop machines?

	Is the item linked to ToDo or Datebook? (ie: If an item is in the
handheld, and desktop, and also linked out to ToDo or Datebook... then a
change on the desktop may get clobbered by the external ToDo or Datebook
item, snice it gets checked when you open the list, not at sync time).

> Just out of curiousity, how is it that Palm desktop syncs with no
> problems, on different computers, but syncing in other programs is so
> much more complex?  I am sure there is a good answer, but it is not
> obvious to this layman.

	Palm Desktop programs (like ToDo, Memopad, etc) are all programs
where the items have no relations or complexity. ie: Every single ToDo is
separate from every other ToDo. Shadow data is relational and much mroe
complex, with items takling to each other in many ways.

	Consider: A ToDo list .. it is flat. There are no children versus
parents. An item is just up or down in the database, and that doesn't even
matter to it.. the item is just an island unto itself.

	In Shadow we have to worry about relationships like "contains"; if
you move an item to be a child of another item, and them move another item
to eb a child o that one.. what happens when yuo delete the middle on on
the desktop, or mvoe it somewherre else, so no the handheld relations
different than the desktop relations? The items may be identical, but
*something* has changed..

	It is a much more complex situation in many many ways :)

	See, Palm has carefulyl designed its applications to keep their
lives easy, but as a result, you can see the limits of those applications.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:20pm
Subject: Re: What to do with Tungsten 5-way Pad?

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, G. Edw. Learned wrote:

> How about left right for zoom/unzoom?

	How woudl we do the select/unselect then?

	I wonder if it can detect that the center button is pressed, *and*
the disc is pushing right? It would be cool to "push and roll your
thumb" to have that as an extra function? Then that could be zoom or
something.


	Crrrraaaaazy :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: mzehner2000  <matt_zehner@p...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:21pm
Subject: Re: mass promotion of children?

Anthony,

SWEET! Worked like a charm, so thanks for the help.  You might want 
to post that to shadow-tips!  

Cheers,
Matt

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Anthony Schellenberg <aschell@p...> wrote:
> Open list preferences and click the opt button.  There is an option 
there called 'suppress autocheck'  make sure this option is not 
selected.  Then in your list you should be able to just change your 
newly imported list into the checklist style so that everything has a 
checkbox, then checking the 3 parent items should cause all children 
to be checked.  Then go back to list preferences and turn that option 
on.  Then you can uncheck the parents and all the children stay 
checked
> 
> >desktop), or check every child and then use "Cut and Uncheck All 
> >Checked" and paste into the top level - but any solution that 
> >requires me to manually touch every item seems to me to be 
> >unacceptable, or at least very unsatisfactory when dealing with so 
> >many items.  
>

From: mzehner2000  <matt_zehner@p...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:25pm
Subject: Re: mass promotion of children?

Neal, thanks VERY much for the warning - using your method in 
combination with the approach Anthony suggested, I'm in business as 
desired.  

Cheers,
Matt

> 
> IF you make the promotion changes on the HH AND then delete the 
original
> parent BEFORE you sync with the DT, the promoted children will be 
deleted as
> well. (of course they can be restored from backups, but that's 
another step
> you don't want to take.)
> 
> Procedure to avoid this:
> 1.  Promote all children - I'll leave it up to you as to how :-)
> 2.  Sync with DT.
> 3.  Delete original parent - Someday/Maybe in your case
>

From: Russ & Ling  <rnlnero@y...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 6:48pm
Subject: Re: What to do with Tungsten 5-way Pad?

Jeff Mitchell wrote:
>
>[snip]
> However, using up/down to scroll the selection or view, and
> left/right to select or unselect, sounds reasonable and would fit into the
> existing jog dial code reasonably easily. We could use the push-button to
> open details, or perhaps do checkbox toggling and leave the detail window
> to the left/right action. So in effect we could use up/down just as with
> jog dial, and use left/right to simulate the jog push and back button
> push.. that leaves us with the center push button tobe something new, like
> toggle checkbox.

How about use the center push button as a toggle to expand/collapse?

Ling
--

From: G. Edw. Learned  <learned@v...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 7:10pm
Subject: Re: What to do with Tungsten 5-way Pad?

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002 13:20:07 -0500 (EST), Jeff Mitchell wrote:
>How woudl we do the select/unselect then?
>
>I wonder if it can detect that the center button is pressed, *and*
>
>the disc is pushing right? It would be cool to "push and roll your
>thumb" to have that as an extra function? Then that could be zoom or
>something.

I was thinking use the push button for select...sort of...

If you have been scrolling up or down, it will select. If you have 
selected, it will open. If it is open, it will close. To unselect, 
just start scrolling with up and down again. Of course that doesn't 
address how to get to notes.

Just random thoughts at this point.

Ed

From: mdc00000  <mdc00000@y...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 8:41pm
Subject: Desktop install

Jeff,

I downloaded 2.6 from your website today, and ran the setup program 
to install it.  Handheld upgraded fine.  Desktop v1.2.5 installed but 
shows up unregistered.  I previously registered the desktop but got a 
new pc at work and had not installed it yet, so this was a new 
install for the desktop.

When launching the desktop, a message advising me to enter the code 
on the handheld side appeared.  I have two codes: one for the 
original handheld purchase and one for the desktop 1.0 upgrade.  Re-
entering the handheld code works, but does not register the desktop.  
Entering the desktop code fails.

What am I doing wrong?

Thanks,
Mike

(Palm Vx, OS 3.5.2, eyeing the new OS5 goodies...)

From: tarasofsky  <Tarasofsky@t...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 8:49pm
Subject: Re: syncing problems

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
>> 
> 	Is 2.6 installed on both desktop machines?
> 
> 	Is the item linked to ToDo or Datebook? (ie: If an item is in 
the
> handheld, and desktop, and also linked out to ToDo or Datebook... 
then a
> change on the desktop may get clobbered by the external ToDo or 
Datebook
> item, snice it gets checked when you open the list, not at sync 
time).
>

Yes 2.6 is on both desktops. And you are right, the items involved 
were indeed linked to ToDo.  Any work around available?

Richard

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 8:57pm
Subject: Re: Desktop install

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, mdc00000 wrote:

> I downloaded 2.6 from your website today, and ran the setup program to
> install it.  Handheld upgraded fine.  Desktop v1.2.5 installed but
> shows up unregistered.  I previously registered the desktop but got a
> new pc at work and had not installed it yet, so this was a new install
> for the desktop.
> 
> When launching the desktop, a message advising me to enter the code on
> the handheld side appeared.  I have two codes: one for the original
> handheld purchase and one for the desktop 1.0 upgrade.  Re- entering
> the handheld code works, but does not register the desktop.  Entering
> the desktop code fails.

	The desktop gets its registration from the handheld during
synchronization. As such, snice you bought in two steps, your handheld
must be registered twice -- first with your handheld code, then with your
expansion code. (You cannot just enter the expansion code, since people
would just buy the expansion package and I'd go out of business ;)

	So if your second code doesn't work, you must msiremember or
misenter it or the like. Send me your hotsync ID and your two codes in
private email.

		jeff

	And your codes will still work for OS5 :)

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 8:58pm
Subject: Re: Re: syncing problems

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, tarasofsky wrote:

> the
> > handheld, and desktop, and also linked out to ToDo or Datebook... 
> then a
> > change on the desktop may get clobbered by the external ToDo or 
> Datebook
> > item, snice it gets checked when you open the list, not at sync 
> time).
> >
> 
> Yes 2.6 is on both desktops. And you are right, the items involved 
> were indeed linked to ToDo.  Any work around available?

	When an item is linked to the ToDo or Datebook, for now, those
applications become the master (ie: The Shadow Desktop gets clobbered by
Palm Desktop). In this case, you can change those items in Palm Desktop
(since it is the master).

	I will be changing some stuff so that the two condutis cooperate a
little better with co-owned objects. (Whew, say that 3 times fast ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: mdc00000  <mdc00000@y...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 9:20pm
Subject: Re: Desktop install

Jeff,
I tried resyncing with the handheld code, then re-entered the desktop 
code and it worked.   Murphy's law - I tried this several times 
before posting my message, with no luck, then posted, tried again & 
it worked.  Maybe I copied the code with a trailing blank or 
something the previous times.

Anyway, thanks for the quick reply - that's truly impressive 
support.  Desktop drag & drop looks good!

Mike


--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, mdc00000 wrote:
> 
> > I downloaded 2.6 from your website today, and ran the setup 
program to
> > install it.  Handheld upgraded fine.  Desktop v1.2.5 installed but
> > shows up unregistered.  I previously registered the desktop but 
got a
> > new pc at work and had not installed it yet, so this was a new 
install
> > for the desktop.
> > 
> > When launching the desktop, a message advising me to enter the 
code on
> > the handheld side appeared.  I have two codes: one for the 
original
> > handheld purchase and one for the desktop 1.0 upgrade.  Re- 
entering
> > the handheld code works, but does not register the desktop.  
Entering
> > the desktop code fails.
> 
> 	The desktop gets its registration from the handheld during
> synchronization. As such, snice you bought in two steps, your 
handheld
> must be registered twice -- first with your handheld code, then 
with your
> expansion code. (You cannot just enter the expansion code, since 
people
> would just buy the expansion package and I'd go out of business ;)
> 
> 	So if your second code doesn't work, you must msiremember or
> misenter it or the like. Send me your hotsync ID and your two codes 
in
> private email.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> 	And your codes will still work for OS5 :)
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: fisticfighter  <fisticfighter@y...>
Date: Wed Oct 30, 2002 11:55pm
Subject: Desktop feature request

Jeff,

One feature I would like to see in the Desktop is an option allowing 
URL's in a Shadow list to be displayed as hyperlinks, such that I 
could click on a URL and launch IE or another browser from an open 
file.  Although not a high priority item I'm sure, I think it would 
be very useful.

Thanks,

Aaron

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 1:52am
Subject: Re: Desktop feature request

On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, fisticfighter wrote:

> One feature I would like to see in the Desktop is an option allowing
> URL's in a Shadow list to be displayed as hyperlinks, such that I
> could click on a URL and launch IE or another browser from an open
> file.  Although not a high priority item I'm sure, I think it would be
> very useful.

	Yep; we'll see. Theres various complications around that, so its
lower priority than some other stuff.. but I'd like it too :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: mr_hank_01  <mr_hank_01@y...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 2:12am
Subject: Re: DT to HH sync problem

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Wed, 30 Oct 2002, mr_hank_01 wrote:
> 
> > I'm still on the beta 5.  Not sure if this is a problem or if 
I've 
> > not set some setting correctly.
> > 
> > With a file sync'ed, I made some edits on the DT copy (added a 
couple 
> > items, edited a couple items), then resync.  When I check the HH, 
I 
> > see:
> > 
> > 1 - new items came across OK.
> > 2 - in that section (parent on down) I just added to, ALL items 
are 
> > now checked as if completed.  (Actually, I suspected this was 
going 
> > to happen when I saw all items in the DT screen had the "Finished 
> > Date" filled in with today's date
> 
> 	That would suggest they were already checked when they got to 
the
> desktop. Did you accidentally hit the Checkbox somewhere along the
> line? (like on the parent, and thus checkign all the children?)

------
Appears something like that happened.
------

> 
> > 3 - edited items - changes did not come across.
> 
> 	Are they linked to ToDo or Datebook? (ie: I so, then the 
linked
> object becomes the master when "outside of Shadow", so you then 
have 3
> sources of truth, with the external linked object takign precedence)
> (Yeah, I need to think about this. Its getting complicated ;)
--------
Yes, to do links on those items; thanks for the insight.
--------

> 
> 	Does this help?
--- Yes - thank you

> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: droeh  <droeh@y...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 1:20pm
Subject: Having a problem with my expat.dll file . . .

whatever that is.

Here's the specs:   Downloaded 2.6.  Only need the desktop as I have 
shadow on my palm but needed desktop for my new pc.  Am registered 
with you.

when installing using setup.exe, I get a "catapult error message" and 
installation terminates.

when doing the manual method, I get an error message telling me that 
it could not find an expat.dll file.  

When doing a file search, I find that I have four of this file - all 
in my C:\Windows\Temp files.

How do I move them to where Shadow Plan can find them?

Thanks - I love my Palm Shadow - really lookin forward to the desktop!

Martha Sheppard

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 2:55pm
Subject: Re: Having a problem with my expat.dll file . . .

On Thu, 31 Oct 2002, droeh wrote:

> Here's the specs:   Downloaded 2.6.  Only need the desktop as I have 
> shadow on my palm but needed desktop for my new pc.  Am registered 
> with you.
> 
> when installing using setup.exe, I get a "catapult error message" and 
> installation terminates.

	Strange. What windows OS version?

	Tried rebooting and installing again? (I've been using the same
version of the catapult setup builder for a year or so now, and its been
very reliable)

> when doing the manual method, I get an error message telling me that
> it could not find an expat.dll file.

	You can find the expat.dll in the distribution By_Hand
directory; copy it to the same location as your hotsync.exe (you can do a
file find for it), and you should be cool. It also needs to be where you
are installing shadow.exe to.

> When doing a file search, I find that I have four of this file - all
> in my C:\Windows\Temp files.
> 
> How do I move them to where Shadow Plan can find them?
> 
> Thanks - I love my Palm Shadow - really lookin forward to the desktop!

	Try installing again. It should work fine. If you're using NT,
perhaps you need to make sure you're an administrator? (Some NT's are
screwy this way)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: wbornstein  <wbornstein@a...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 4:42pm
Subject: Outlining

I've corresponded with Jeff on this, but I thought I should see what 
others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that would 
not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
whatever depth is needed.  Currently, I have to set the default for 
the first three levels for each list and then remember at level 4 and 
below to set it for each new group of children.  Do others have a 
similar need?

Bill

From: Earthlink  <kevin@g...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 9:29pm
Subject: Re: Outlining

Not here, don't go that far into multi-levels.  The few times that I might need to I just do it manually with input myself.  I could see maybe a fourth level being added, but with too many levels we lose our screen to only numbers.  My thoughts...
Kevin

----- Original Message ----- 
  From: wbornstein 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, October 31, 2002 8:42 AM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Outlining


  I've corresponded with Jeff on this, but I thought I should see what 
  others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
  would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that would 
  not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
  whatever depth is needed.  Currently, I have to set the default for 
  the first three levels for each list and then remember at level 4 and 
  below to set it for each new group of children.  Do others have a 
  similar need?

  Bill



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: bjohnson567  <bjohnson@n...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 9:34pm
Subject: How do you transfer Tags to Outlook?

When I link a shadow item to a to-do, I would like to pass the Tag(s) 
that are attached to the Shadow item to MS Outlook when I sync.  Does 
anyone have any suggestions for sync sofware (or other solution) to 
accomplish this?

From: smasters@a...
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 9:56pm
Subject: Re: How do you transfer Tags to Outlook?

I don't believe this can be done at the present time. Well, other than
copying the tags into the note. Then they'd sync over with the ToDo. A lot
of extra work, but you'd have to weigh the value. Hope this helps.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 10:04pm
Subject: Re: How do you transfer Tags to Outlook?

On Thu, 31 Oct 2002, bjohnson567 wrote:

> When I link a shadow item to a to-do, I would like to pass the Tag(s)  
> that are attached to the Shadow item to MS Outlook when I sync.  Does
> anyone have any suggestions for sync software (or other solution) to
> accomplish this?

	Shadow doesn't talk to Outlook at this time... not directly
anyway. We can link items to the ToDo and Datebook databases, and Outlook
will sync those. Since those databases don't have the ability to tag
items, it would have to be as text. For instance, you could turn on
"Origin Stamps" for linked objects, and then you would see filename and
parental hierarchy for those linked items, but not tags. Including tags
(or perhaps the Prime tag) in origin stamps or the like could perhaps be
an option, but its not something you can do now. Neat idea though.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Anthony Schellenberg  <aschell@p...>
Date: Thu Oct 31, 2002 10:27pm
Subject: Origin Stamps was:Re: How do you transfer Tags to Outlook?

>items, it would have to be as text. For instance, you could turn on
>"Origin Stamps" for linked objects, and then you would see filename and
>parental hierarchy for those linked items, but not tags. Including tags
>(or perhaps the Prime tag) in origin stamps or the like could perhaps be
>an option, but its not something you can do now. Neat idea though.
>
>		jeff
Speaking of ideas, I'd love it if Shadow eventually had a per list option to use the heirarchy stamp or the prime tag stamp.  My main action list has very little hierarchy now with tags.  Having every todo link just give me the filename is not too helpful, other than giving me a quick way to jump via shadowlink.  For tag stamps, I'd love an option for just filename>>primary tag.  At first I was thinking just primary tag, but I'd still like to use shadowlink to jump.

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From: Shaun Smith  <ssmith@s...>
Date: Fri Nov 1, 2002 11:22pm
Subject: RE: Outline Numbering

I too would like to see AutoNumbering go beyond 3 levels deep.  Many of my
outlines end up 7-8 layers deep, so I have to manually number anything
beyond 3.  Now that version 2.6 address the problem of retaining numbering
beyond the third level, I don't have to renumber everything quite so often.

I do have a slight work around that I have been using:  Since all of the
children under one parent will adopt the numbering of a sibling, (would that
be peer pressure??!!), I keep a 9 level template-item at the bottom of my
list.  When I add a new item to the list, I begin by copying this template,
pasting it in the appropriate location and then filling it in.  Since all of
the numbering is now "predefined", each child will adopt the correct
numbering type.  

While this works for creating an outline, it does nothing for editing,
leaving the outline format fairly static and isn't dynamic information the
whole point??

Shaun


________________________________________________________________________

Message: 3
   Date: Thu, 31 Oct 2002 16:42:54 -0000
   From: "wbornstein" <wbornstein@a...>
Subject: Outlining

I've corresponded with Jeff on this, but I thought I should see what 
others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that would 
not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
whatever depth is needed.  Currently, I have to set the default for 
the first three levels for each list and then remember at level 4 and 
below to set it for each new group of children.  Do others have a 
similar need?

Bill

From: vjornes  <vjornes@y...>
Date: Sat Nov 2, 2002 1:32am
Subject: Re: Outline Numbering

I'd like to use autonumbering but knowing it stops a level 3 has 
always been a disincentive.

It would be nice to have the autonumbering work in the desktop.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sat Nov 2, 2002 1:42am
Subject: Re: Re: Outline Numbering

On Sat, 2 Nov 2002, vjornes wrote:

> I'd like to use autonumbering but knowing it stops a level 3 has 
> always been a disincentive.
> 
> It would be nice to have the autonumbering work in the desktop.

	It will definitely come to the desktop. We'll work out deep
auto-numbering too, sooner or later :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: pfieldho_99  <pfieldho_99@y...>
Date: Sat Nov 2, 2002 6:25am
Subject: Re: Outlining

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "wbornstein" <wbornstein@a...> wrote:
> I've corresponded with Jeff on this, but I thought I should see 
what 
> others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
> would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that 
would 
> not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
> whatever depth is needed.  

I've brought this concatenation scheme of numbering up here in this 
forum as well. Jeff's thoughts were that to go much beyond what is 
now possible in ShadowPlan (3 as a list preference and a couple more 
that siblings will automatically inherit) would take up too much 
screen territory. 

Currently, I have to set the default for 
> the first three levels for each list and then remember at level 4 
and 
> below to set it for each new group of children.  Do others have a 
> similar need?
> 
> Bill


What I do because of this limitation is to have a network of lists 
rather than very deep lists. I rarely use the file selection screen --
 rather I have a master table of contents (personal, 
family/household, work, etc) that links to tables of contents for 
each of those topics. I find that I actually move around my lists 
(103 at the present) faster through this network than navigating by 
way of the file selection screen. As I develop a new list and it 
starts to go deeper than 4 levels I break off the appropriate items 
into a seperate linked list. A couple branches of my tree have tables 
of contents of lists 3 levels deep.

I have currently recaptured a lot of my 
screen space by using 6-point fonts and I still wonder about the 
concatenation numbering scheme -- but what I have going right now 
works.

Paul

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sat Nov 2, 2002 9:26pm
Subject: Re: Re: Outlining

On Sat, 2 Nov 2002, pfieldho_99 wrote:

> > others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
> > would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that 
> would 
> > not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
> > whatever depth is needed.  
> 
> I've brought this concatenation scheme of numbering up here in this 
> forum as well. Jeff's thoughts were that to go much beyond what is 
> now possible in ShadowPlan (3 as a list preference and a couple more 
> that siblings will automatically inherit) would take up too much 
> screen territory. 

	I'm not against it, I'm just afraid of using u your whole screen
for numbering ;) However, that may be less of a concern seeing as highres
is about to become widespread :)

	I'm not sure I want to have the List Prefs screen have a giant
enforcement section.. so I may have to provide an anlternate screen to
specify level locks or the like. We'll see. Keep bugging me :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Sun Nov 3, 2002 0:39am
Subject: Re: Re: Outlining

any way to have the desktop allow more levels, and not the handheld?  i understand syncing may create confusion, but maybe something that notes if levels created in desktop, so when displayed on the desktop more levels show, but on handheld not shown; and if create on handheld, won't create more levels on desktop unless changed on desktop?

would seem the suggestions are really for use and display on the desktop any how, right?

just a thought.

kevin
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Jeff Mitchell 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, November 02, 2002 1:26 PM
  Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Re: Outlining


  On Sat, 2 Nov 2002, pfieldho_99 wrote:

  > > others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel outlines.  I 
  > > would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference that 
  > would 
  > > not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on to 
  > > whatever depth is needed.  
  > 
  > I've brought this concatenation scheme of numbering up here in this 
  > forum as well. Jeff's thoughts were that to go much beyond what is 
  > now possible in ShadowPlan (3 as a list preference and a couple more 
  > that siblings will automatically inherit) would take up too much 
  > screen territory. 

        I'm not against it, I'm just afraid of using u your whole screen
  for numbering ;) However, that may be less of a concern seeing as highres
  is about to become widespread :)

        I'm not sure I want to have the List Prefs screen have a giant
  enforcement section.. so I may have to provide an anlternate screen to
  specify level locks or the like. We'll see. Keep bugging me :)

              jeff



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: hawkin00  <hawkin00@y...>
Date: Sun Nov 3, 2002 6:01pm
Subject: Bad load

I installed the 2.6 version the other day. I have a list that I wrote 
after installing the new version that I can't get to now. When I try, 
I get the msg. "Bad load. This list could not be loaded." Then when I 
go to another app, I get a Fatal Error. Something 
about "MemoryMgrNew.c, Line 4183, Invalid chunk ptr." I can do a soft 
reset and get back to work but I still can't access that 1 list. I 
tried to access it on the desktop but it lists the first line and 
then nothing else. I'm going to delete the list and start over. What 
caused this to happen and how can I keep it from happening again? TIA

From: Michael Rudnick  <egroups@R...>
Date: Sun Nov 3, 2002 6:29pm
Subject: Desktop Feature Request

Request for the Desktop: If I make changes to a list and then click
close, I get a dialog box with two choices, Yes (save changes) and No
(don't save changes). Can we have a Cancel button as well? That will
help those of us who click before they think <g>.
--
Michael Rudnick                         
egroups@r...

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Nov 3, 2002 9:47pm
Subject: Re: Bad load

On Sun, 3 Nov 2002, hawkin00 wrote:

> I installed the 2.6 version the other day. I have a list that I wrote
> after installing the new version that I can't get to now. When I try,
> I get the msg. "Bad load. This list could not be loaded." Then when I
> go to another app, I get a Fatal Error. Something about
> "MemoryMgrNew.c, Line 4183, Invalid chunk ptr." I can do a soft reset
> and get back to work but I still can't access that 1 list. I tried to
> access it on the desktop but it lists the first line and then nothing
> else. I'm going to delete the list and start over. What caused this to
> happen and how can I keep it from happening again? TIA

	Curious; 2.6 cannot really damage files, unless something
extremely bizarre happens on your handheld. Are you sure you've got 2.6
installed (And not 2.5.something?)

	If the name of tyhe file is "foo" on your handheld, do a search
for "ShadP-foo.PDB" on your desktop (case insensitively), to find the raw
PDB backup. Try opening that with Shadow Desktop (using Open PDB from the
base window file menu).  It may or may not handle a "broken file", but
theres a good chance it can fetch out a bunch of the content and allow you
to "Save as" and make a new XML or PDB file to send back to the handheld
(to save re-creating the list). It is generally very hard to lose data,
even in themost dire of circumstances.

	Without knowing more detail, I cannot see how it could happen with
2.6 fully installed. (You have conduit 2.0? You can tell from the sync
progress box for Shadow, while you're syncing)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Nov 3, 2002 9:48pm
Subject: Re: Desktop Feature Request

On Sun, 3 Nov 2002, Michael Rudnick wrote:

> Request for the Desktop: If I make changes to a list and then click
> close, I get a dialog box with two choices, Yes (save changes) and No
> (don't save changes). Can we have a Cancel button as well? That will
> help those of us who click before they think <g>.

	Sure; thats on my list of things to add :) I'm always falling
victem to that myself actually.. minimizing a bunch of windows, then
closing the base window, and get a slew of yes/no's :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: wbornstein  <wbornstein@a...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 2:53am
Subject: Re: Outlining

Actually, I need it on the handheld where I use deep outlining for 
note taking.
Bill

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Kevin Giberson" <kevin@g...> wrote:
> any way to have the desktop allow more levels, and not the 
handheld?  i understand syncing may create confusion, but maybe 
something that notes if levels created in desktop, so when displayed 
on the desktop more levels show, but on handheld not shown; and if 
create on handheld, won't create more levels on desktop unless 
changed on desktop?
> 
> would seem the suggestions are really for use and display on the 
desktop any how, right?
> 
> just a thought.
> 
> kevin
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Jeff Mitchell 
>   To: shadow-discuss@y... 
>   Sent: Saturday, November 02, 2002 1:26 PM
>   Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Re: Outlining
> 
> 
>   On Sat, 2 Nov 2002, pfieldho_99 wrote:
> 
>   > > others think.  I have a need to generate multilevel 
outlines.  I 
>   > > would like to be able to set a numbering scheme preference 
that 
>   > would 
>   > > not be limited to three levels--e.g., 1.1, 1.1.1, and so on 
to 
>   > > whatever depth is needed.  
>   > 
>   > I've brought this concatenation scheme of numbering up here in 
this 
>   > forum as well. Jeff's thoughts were that to go much beyond what 
is 
>   > now possible in ShadowPlan (3 as a list preference and a couple 
more 
>   > that siblings will automatically inherit) would take up too 
much 
>   > screen territory. 
> 
>         I'm not against it, I'm just afraid of using u your whole 
screen
>   for numbering ;) However, that may be less of a concern seeing as 
highres
>   is about to become widespread :)
> 
>         I'm not sure I want to have the List Prefs screen have a 
giant
>   enforcement section.. so I may have to provide an anlternate 
screen to
>   specify level locks or the like. We'll see. Keep bugging me :)
> 
>               jeff
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: N. Sean Timm  <lists-yahoo@x...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 5:44am
Subject: Re[2]: Desktop Feature Request

Sunday, November 3, 2002, 2:48:34 PM, Jeff Mitchell wrote:

JM> On Sun, 3 Nov 2002, Michael Rudnick wrote:

>> Request for the Desktop: If I make changes to a list and then click
>> close, I get a dialog box with two choices, Yes (save changes) and No
>> (don't save changes). Can we have a Cancel button as well? That will
>> help those of us who click before they think <g>.

JM>         Sure; thats on my list of things to add :) I'm always falling
JM> victem to that myself actually.. minimizing a bunch of windows, then
JM> closing the base window, and get a slew of yes/no's :)

I'm probably evil for suggesting this, but I'd rather have it
automatically save whatever changes I make but have persistent undo
capability, so if I accidently make a change, I can undo then, or I
can close and undo later.  :)

I personally find the constant prompting of programs to be quite
annoying, and with a flexible undo mechanism, quite unnecessary.  If I
didn't want a change, I wouldn't have made it, dang it!  :)

-- 
Best regards,
 N. Sean Timm             mailto:lists-yahoo@x...

From: hawkin00  <hawkin00@y...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 1:47pm
Subject: Re: Bad load

Jeff, I checked and I do have the 2.6.0 version. I downloaded the 
desktop and handheld as one unit so I assume I have the right 
conduit. 

Could this be the problem? I think I may have started the list on the 
desktop and instead of having the desktop send it to the handheld, I 
just checked the Synch box on the list preferences menu. I think this 
is the only list that I started on the desktop. Anyhoo, TIA.

From: George David R-G16477  <d.george@m...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 2:24pm
Subject: Shadow and MS Project

Anyone out there have any luck exporting data from Shadow into MS Project?  or maybe this could be a feature request?
 

Thanx! 
  
David George
IT System Engineer
Motorola ESG
Lawrenceville GA
770-338-3888 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 2:34pm
Subject: Re: Re: Bad load

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, hawkin00 wrote:

> Jeff, I checked and I do have the 2.6.0 version. I downloaded the 
> desktop and handheld as one unit so I assume I have the right 
> conduit. 
> 
> Could this be the problem? I think I may have started the list on the
> desktop and instead of having the desktop send it to the handheld, I
> just checked the Synch box on the list preferences menu. I think this
> is the only list that I started on the desktop. Anyhoo, TIA.

	No, thats fine.

	Send me the top portion of a lastsync.txt file (you can do a file
find to locate one) to support@c... and I'll take a look, see if
theres any gives. Otherwise, I'm at a bit of a loss (ie: Don't have enough
information to go on).

	Anyway, if you want to get the contents of the file back, let me
know privately; I'll walk you through a few options.. we can probably get
all the content back in a snap.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 2:36pm
Subject: Re: Shadow and MS Project

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, George David R-G16477 wrote:

> Anyone out there have any luck exporting data from Shadow into MS
> Project?  or maybe this could be a feature request?

	I had someone a couple months back send me an import format
MSPRoject likes; if you coudl also nail down an import format, send it to
me privately. I wouid like to build a CSV export from Shadow that you
could then import into MSProject.

	I suppose what I really need (that likely no one but me can
provide ;) is a CSV layout that woudl allow me to export it to MSPRoject,
and then that MSPRoject could itself export so we could share the same
data back and forth between MSProject. I don't know if Microsoft makes
that easy. It'll certainly be easier for future XML based MSOffice apps :/

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 2:44pm
Subject: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

Shadow Plan 2.6 (and even 2.5 I think) works perfectly on OS5
units. Just doesn't take advantage of them, but does work perfectly.

	I've just last night put together an alpha that works in high res
on the two new OS5 units, so that it takes advantage of the high density
screens (though not the virtual grafitti on the NX series. Not just yet)

	Its alpha, though seems to work very well. Is there a lot of
OS5'ers out here yet?

	I can post it on the site with a warning if theres interest.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 3:07pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

I definitely want to try it out. Yours is the only program I've tried
that has worked without any problems on my Tungsten.

One question though-- since the unit is so much faster/more responsive,
I am having HORRIBLE problems with unintentional dragging. Is there
something we can do about this, PLEASE????

Jen

-------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!


-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Mitchell [mailto:support@s...] 
Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 8:44 AM
To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [shadow-discuss] OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?


	Shadow Plan 2.6 (and even 2.5 I think) works perfectly on OS5
units. Just doesn't take advantage of them, but does work perfectly.

	I've just last night put together an alpha that works in high
res
on the two new OS5 units, so that it takes advantage of the high density
screens (though not the virtual grafitti on the NX series. Not just yet)

	Its alpha, though seems to work very well. Is there a lot of
OS5'ers out here yet?

	I can post it on the site with a warning if theres interest.

		jeff

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 5:19pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, PocketGoddess wrote:

> I definitely want to try it out. Yours is the only program I've tried
> that has worked without any problems on my Tungsten.

	Try it out and let me know if I should post it to the website :)

	http://www.codejedi.com/shadowplan/shadow-test/shadow262a.zip

	Alpha warning.

> One question though-- since the unit is so much faster/more
> responsive, I am having HORRIBLE problems with unintentional dragging.
> Is there something we can do about this, PLEASE????

	Yep; I'm going to add some sort of drag threshold in ASAP. I'm not
sure how just yet, but will soon ehough.. ie: If you want to drag only one
row up, will you need to drag further than that to trigger the drag, and
then come back down to drop it, for instance? ie: How far must the drga go
before it sets off a drag?

		jeff

> 
> Jen
> 
> -------------
> PocketGoddess
> http://www.pocketgoddess.com
> 98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Mitchell [mailto:support@s...] 
> Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 8:44 AM
> To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [shadow-discuss] OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?
> 
> 
> 	Shadow Plan 2.6 (and even 2.5 I think) works perfectly on OS5
> units. Just doesn't take advantage of them, but does work perfectly.
> 
> 	I've just last night put together an alpha that works in high
> res
> on the two new OS5 units, so that it takes advantage of the high density
> screens (though not the virtual grafitti on the NX series. Not just yet)
> 
> 	Its alpha, though seems to work very well. Is there a lot of
> OS5'ers out here yet?
> 
> 	I can post it on the site with a warning if theres interest.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> 
>  
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> 
> 
> 

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 5:52pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

I still think some sort of time delay might be nice too, because I am
usually trying to do nothing more than expand collapse or check a
checkbox. Perhaps if you do the Navigator pad implementation "right"
some of the things I use the stylus for that cause unintentional drags
could be done with button presses instead. I would LOVE left/right to
expand/collapse! Maybe a toggle on one side, so that the other side
could be used to check the checkbox if present, or perhaps the center
button would check the check box. It takes a really long press to get
back to the launcher, so maybe that would work.

Jen

-------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!


-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Mitchell [mailto:support@s...] 
Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 11:20 AM
To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [shadow-discuss] OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want
it?

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, PocketGoddess wrote:

> I definitely want to try it out. Yours is the only program I've tried
> that has worked without any problems on my Tungsten.

	Try it out and let me know if I should post it to the website :)

	http://www.codejedi.com/shadowplan/shadow-test/shadow262a.zip

	Alpha warning.

> One question though-- since the unit is so much faster/more
> responsive, I am having HORRIBLE problems with unintentional dragging.
> Is there something we can do about this, PLEASE????

	Yep; I'm going to add some sort of drag threshold in ASAP. I'm
not
sure how just yet, but will soon ehough.. ie: If you want to drag only
one
row up, will you need to drag further than that to trigger the drag, and
then come back down to drop it, for instance? ie: How far must the drga
go
before it sets off a drag?

		jeff

> 
> Jen
> 
> -------------
> PocketGoddess
> http://www.pocketgoddess.com
> 98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jeff Mitchell [mailto:support@s...] 
> Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 8:44 AM
> To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [shadow-discuss] OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want
it?
> 
> 
> 	Shadow Plan 2.6 (and even 2.5 I think) works perfectly on OS5
> units. Just doesn't take advantage of them, but does work perfectly.
> 
> 	I've just last night put together an alpha that works in high
> res
> on the two new OS5 units, so that it takes advantage of the high
density
> screens (though not the virtual grafitti on the NX series. Not just
yet)
> 
> 	Its alpha, though seems to work very well. Is there a lot of
> OS5'ers out here yet?
> 
> 	I can post it on the site with a warning if theres interest.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> 
>  
> 
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> 
> 
> 

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_



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From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 7:28pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, PocketGoddess wrote:

> I still think some sort of time delay might be nice too, because I am
> usually trying to do nothing more than expand collapse or check a
> checkbox. Perhaps if you do the Navigator pad implementation "right"
> some of the things I use the stylus for that cause unintentional drags
> could be done with button presses instead. I would LOVE left/right to
> expand/collapse! Maybe a toggle on one side, so that the other side
> could be used to check the checkbox if present, or perhaps the center
> button would check the check box. It takes a really long press to get
> back to the launcher, so maybe that would work.

	I chanegd the voice button to go to launcher; much faster. Too bad
you cannot redefine the center buntton to do voice though :) (whe held)

	I'm undecided abtuo the 5-way yet; I'm hoping as peopel get it,
they'll let me know..

	ie: We need to be able to do one handed navigation; since the TT
has no jog dial and instead has the 5-way, it has to do more or less the
same sorts of things. If there was a back button, we could use left and
right for stuff (using up/down as analagous to the jog dial).. but there
isn't. So we must use left/right for the same thigs as jog-push
(right) and back button (left)...

	So I'm thinking like this:

	(All for the 5-way d-pad controller)

	Up:
	If nothing selected, page up.
	If selection, select previous item.

	Down: Opposite of Up :)

	Right:
	If nothing selected, select top visible item.
	If selection, not-parent, open up details.
	If selection, is a parent, expand it.. or if already
		expanded, open Details.

	Left:
	If nothing selected, go to file selection screen.
	If selection, collapse (if parent). If not parent, deselect.

	This seems to make some sense.. except that once you're in
Details, the center-button is Done (the OS does that). So its a little
inconsistent...

	However, with the above scheme, we have the center button entirely
unused. I thought we could use it to toggle collapse maybe, or toggle
checkbox, or somesuch..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 7:30pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

However, with the above scheme, we have the center button
entirely
unused. I thought we could use it to toggle collapse maybe, or toggle
checkbox, or somesuch..

Toggle checkbox, since expand/collapse work with left and right!

Jen

-------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 10:06pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

It works. I can't see a darn thing in the alpha when I turn on hi res
(that print is WAY too tiny), but it works. Any news on when fontbucket
might work?

Jen

-------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 10:18pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, PocketGoddess wrote:

> It works. I can't see a darn thing in the alpha when I turn on hi res
> (that print is WAY too tiny), but it works. Any news on when
> fontbucket might work?

	Font Bucket (latest version) works fine, I think. I'm using it on
my unit, but I've not installed any font packs.. but I use it to fiddle
with the built in fonts and it works no problem.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Kenneth S. Rhee  <polymath@m...>
Date: Mon Nov 4, 2002 10:37pm
Subject: RE: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

I can confirm that it works in my Clie NX
--
Kenneth S. Rhee, polymath@m... on 11/04/2002

From: gf_gollum  <gf_gollum@y...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 1:14am
Subject: Re: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

> 
> 	http://www.codejedi.com/shadowplan/shadow-test/shadow262a.zip
> 
Is this ONLY for the NX.. or can I try on on my OS4, NR70 with the same high res screen?
Graham

From: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 8:29am
Subject: Poll results for shadow-discuss

The following shadow-discuss poll is now closed.  Here are the 
final results: 


POLL QUESTION: Mac OSX users; the Shadow Desktop for
OSX is in alpha testing (see the
screenshot on the website!). I can
expect to get the desktop through
testing reasonably quickly, but the
conduit (that does the syncing) will
take another few weeks or so to get into
testing, plus a few weeks of testing.

Would you rather have a public release
of Shadow Desktop for OSX that initially
does not have a sync conduit? (it can
read and write to your raw PDBs that
Hotsync Manager works with). Or would
you rather wait a month or two to get
the Shadow Desktop including the
conduit, so it just syncs as normal? 

CHOICES AND RESULTS
- I'd like (and purchase since updates are free) OSX Desktop right away! Can live without conduit for awhile, 10 votes, 66.67%  
- I'd like (wouldn't purchase until conduit) OSX Desktop right away! Can live without conduit for awhile, 2 votes, 13.33%  
- I'd rather wait until the conduit is done and tested before getting it, 3 votes, 20.00%  



For more information about this group, please visit 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss 

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From: mhdickens  <mkdickens@a...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 10:08am
Subject: Shadow conduit hangs after fard reset

Here's an interesting one.

I have a problem with my M105 in that when I change the batteries a 
hard reset ensues.

In the past everything has been recovered to my Palm.

The first time I went through this process with the new 2.6 conduit, 
the Conduit hung in the initial setup phase. The HH claimed to be 
syncing the To Do List.

I managed to recover using 2 Custom hotsyncs the first excluding 
Shadow and the second including ONLY Shadow.

Anyone any  ideas as to how to avoid this problem ?

Mark

From: mhdickens  <mkdickens@a...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 10:10am
Subject: Re: Shadow conduit hangs after fard reset

Er ...  I of course meant "hard reset"

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "mhdickens" <mkdickens@a...> wrote:
> Here's an interesting one.
> 
> I have a problem with my M105 in that when I change the batteries a 
> hard reset ensues.
> 
> In the past everything has been recovered to my Palm.
> 
> The first time I went through this process with the new 2.6 
conduit, 
> the Conduit hung in the initial setup phase. The HH claimed to be 
> syncing the To Do List.
> 
> I managed to recover using 2 Custom hotsyncs the first excluding 
> Shadow and the second including ONLY Shadow.
> 
> Anyone any  ideas as to how to avoid this problem ?
> 
> Mark

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 1:13pm
Subject: Re: Re: OS5 highres for Tungsten and Sony NX. Want it?

On Tue, 5 Nov 2002, gf_gollum wrote:

> > 	http://www.codejedi.com/shadowplan/shadow-test/shadow262a.zip

> Is this ONLY for the NX.. or can I try on on my OS4, NR70 with the
> same high res screen?

	Its the regular Shadow version, upped to alpha 2.6.2; it should
work identically on all non-OS5 units as 2.6.0 does. (ie: For you, it
offers high resolution as normal, but not yet virtual grafitti)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 1:16pm
Subject: Re: Shadow conduit hangs after fard reset

On Tue, 5 Nov 2002, mhdickens wrote:

> Here's an interesting one.
> I have a problem with my M105 in that when I change the batteries a 
> hard reset ensues.

	yeah, the new conduit seems to pause or hang during some hard
reset recoveries; it shoudln't be an issue.. next sync all is fine. I'm
not sure about details yet, but I expect it to be fixed in next update (in
a week or two or so hopefully). The issue is that on some Palm Desktops,
Shadow is being given a totally invalid set of data during hard reset
restorations, and the conduit gets hung thinking about it :/

> The first time I went through this process with the new 2.6 conduit, 
> the Conduit hung in the initial setup phase. The HH claimed to be 
> syncing the To Do List.
> 
> I managed to recover using 2 Custom hotsyncs the first excluding 
> Shadow and the second including ONLY Shadow.

	I think you just need to push hotsync again and it'll all work
second sync :/

	Fix coming.

> Anyone any  ideas as to how to avoid this problem ?

	It should be harmless (if a little odd).

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Griff  <keith@t...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 3:49pm
Subject: Re: Dated note taking?

I use the list view and like having the date on the left...the reason 
is it doesn't waste a line for one event.  Your method would require 
two lines for days with only one appointment. To me that's more 
wasteful than the 8 characters wasted now.

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 18 Oct 2002, Michael Davidson wrote:
> 
> > 	I'd liek it to show 1 whole week, including undated todos, 
all in
> a long scrolling list. ie: If one day take sup 10 lines, and trhe 
next is
> 3 lines, thats cool. Using grids like DB5 is prone to is very
> wasteful.. an empty day or day with 1 item take sup as much room as 
a day
> with 10 items, excep ttrh day with 10 items you probably can't see 
them
> all.
> 
> 	It needs to be the lsit view, but better. Efficient. Its not 
quite
> right in any of the views :)
> 
> 	(I know I know, being hard on DB5 is unpopular, but you gotta
> admit I'm right ;)
> 
> > > > Thing Dt
> > > > --------
> > > > Thing
> > > > Thing Dt
> > > 
> > > 	This is generally a UI nono, snice you see thing, then thing, 
then
> > > the date. So you see the date *after* the items you read. 
Usualyl you're
> > 
> > The palm screen is so small that it's really not an issue. You 
see the
> > date and the things all at once, or you train yourself to look at 
the
> > date. 
> 
> 	I don't see any screenshots of Action Names list view, but it 
is
> vastly superior. Sadly, its the onyl feature I need out of a 
dateboko app,
> so I want DB5 to have it or I can't switch to DB5 withotu slownig 
msyelf
> down and breaking my existing hapyp little process :)
> 
> 	ie:
> 
> 	o One column
> 	o List view; scroll list up and down
> 	o Not little same-sized panels for each day.. that makes it 
so you
> must scroll eachlittle panel to see whats on in a given day
> 	o Undated todos must be visible in the list.. top or bottom
> 	o Efficient sue of space; no wastnig a quarter of each line 
for
> dates.
> 
> > > 	List view is here:
> > > http://www.datebk5.com/palmm505-list.gif
> > > 	It has the nasty waste I've mentioned..
> > 
> > It looks clean and uncluttered to me! I'm beginning to feel like 
you have
> > something strange against DB5... ;)
> 
> 	Uncluttered? Do you see how every line has a date? thats 100%
> wasted space.. if those items all happen to be on the same day. 
Thats *bad
> design* in every textbook you'll find :) CESD doesn't usualyl make 
goofy
> mistakes, but thats one of them.. it has to be an option: If you 
tend to
> have one item per day, its good. Very very few of people have 1 
thign
> going on each day :)
> 
> 	No, I'm 100% all for DB5, and I really resent Iambic for their
> stunts. But they got list views just right :) I'm a develoepr and
> perfectionisty as you know.. and I have to have it *right* :)
> 
> 	As I've said before.. if DB5 had a good lsit view, I'd switch 
in a
> second :)  So far my onyl alternative is to build my own simpel 
list view,
> since I cannto mroally use Iambic stuff unless I frogive them, and 
I've
> not thought about that yet. ut I have hopes they learned their 
lesson :/
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 6:54pm
Subject: Handera

OKay, I've gotten 5 people twisting my arm the last 2 days. If
I've let Handera support slide too much, I apologize. I've got a lot of
other forces at work (including thousands of non-Handera users ;), so as
usual.. the grit in the wheel does haev some power ;)

	I'll see what I can do; I'm not going to tackle all of it.. ie:
I'm not sure how many people really care about landscape mode, and if its
work.. it has to wait. But I'll see what I can do about highres support
and whatnot.

	Handera folks are like Mac folks ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 7:08pm
Subject: Shadow 2.6.2 gone beta.. OS 5 high-res

This is a mini release to get you early adopters of the Palm
Tungsten T or the Sony NX70 high resolution. I know I couldn't spend
another hour in low resolution mode ;)

	Get it from the front page of the http://www.codejedi.com site!

	Theres a few little gotchas, but I figured you couldn't wait any
longer.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 7:13pm
Subject: Re: Shadow 2.6.2 gone beta.. OS 5 high-res

Quoting Jeff Mitchell <support@s...>:

> 
> 	This is a mini release to get you early adopters of the Palm
> Tungsten T or the Sony NX70 high resolution. I know I couldn't spend
> another hour in low resolution mode ;)
> 
> 	Get it from the front page of the http://www.codejedi.com site!
> 
> 	Theres a few little gotchas, but I figured you couldn't wait any
> longer.

What are the gotchas?? I didn't see anything mentioned on the site.

And if anyone else has done this, what's the best font you've found? I have 
awful eyes, so I've tried the Garamond 14 bold (as my normal font) and it's not 
quite right. Any suggestions?


Jen
--
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Nov 5, 2002 7:24pm
Subject: Re: Shadow 2.6.2 gone beta.. OS 5 high-res

On Tue, 5 Nov 2002, PocketGoddess wrote:

> > 	This is a mini release to get you early adopters of the Palm
> > Tungsten T or the Sony NX70 high resolution. I know I couldn't spend
> > another hour in low resolution mode ;)
> > 
> > 	Get it from the front page of the http://www.codejedi.com site!
> > 
> > 	Theres a few little gotchas, but I figured you couldn't wait any
> > longer.
> 
> What are the gotchas?? I didn't see anything mentioned on the site.

	The only one I found was that when you're drag-and-dropping that
the items you drag over can get funny looking (low-rezified), until the
drag is complete. Its simply temporary aesthetics.

> And if anyone else has done this, what's the best font you've found? I
> have awful eyes, so I've tried the Garamond 14 bold (as my normal
> font) and it's not quite right. Any suggestions?

	I just use the Palm built-in "large" font, which in high-res mode
is tiny, but not goofily-tiny :) (ie: Palm OS size 12 in Font Bucket
speak, or the large font if not using Font Bucket)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_