From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 1:31pm
Subject: Re: Re: suggestion: DB5 and SP again

On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, McMug wrote:

> BTW, somebody pointed me to PopupFreeTime. It's a hack that shows part
> of the datebook. Unfortunately it only shows the weekly view, which as
> a result only makes the appointments with non-zero durations visible.
> All zero-duration appointments, floats and journals are not visible in
> the hack.
> 
> Incidentally, PopupFreeTime only works with datebook and datebk3, not 
> datebk5. 

	DB5 lives inthe normal datebook database, so DB5 items should show
up as well. If it showed ToDo items, that'd be cool.

> So you can consider add a simple viewer, or sell a separate product
> that does it better than PopupFreeTime!

	Someday. So little time so much to do :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 3:00pm
Subject: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

the highlight function, just wondering cuz I have a t415 clie and it 
doesn't work to well on this unit, it doesn't highlight anything it 
just makes the fonts larger, Just got a T615C so I'm looking forward 
to see some uses I'm just curious..

TIA

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 3:30pm
Subject: Re: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> the highlight function, just wondering cuz I have a t415 clie and it
> doesn't work to well on this unit, it doesn't highlight anything it
> just makes the fonts larger, Just got a T615C so I'm looking forward
> to see some uses I'm just curious..

	Not off topic if you mean the Shadow Hilight function...

	And assuming yuo do.. did you set a colour to hilight to? :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 6:19pm
Subject: Re: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

Nah not yet, I'm getting my t615c in a few days but on my b&w t415 it 
does not give me an option to change a highlight color, ie. a light 
grey or some variation of grey, I've tested the highlight feature on 
my old 610c and its super cool, way to go jeff, it would be cool if 
for example,you can highlight this week's events and past due at the 
same time(diff. colors of course) maybe this can be done I just 
haven't messed with it yet. I'm looking forward to what you mention, 
the misc. field for "weighting"(not sure if I quoted correctly) but 
my prev. post on time factoring..

thanks jeff



--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > the highlight function, just wondering cuz I have a t415 clie and 
it
> > doesn't work to well on this unit, it doesn't highlight anything 
it
> > just makes the fonts larger, Just got a T615C so I'm looking 
forward
> > to see some uses I'm just curious..
> 
> 	Not off topic if you mean the Shadow Hilight function...
> 
> 	And assuming yuo do.. did you set a colour to hilight to? :)
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 7:16pm
Subject: Re: Re: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> Nah not yet, I'm getting my t615c in a few days but on my b&w t415 it 
> does not give me an option to change a highlight color, ie. a light 
> grey or some variation of grey, I've tested the highlight feature on 

	Shadow doesn't support gray on mono units (ie: Since some old
units can do gray, and others not, its a pain to do it well. So I didn't
bother since on many units the gray just washes out anyway :/

> my old 610c and its super cool, way to go jeff, it would be cool if
> for example,you can highlight this week's events and past due at the
> same time(diff. colors of course) maybe this can be done I just
> haven't messed with it yet. I'm looking forward to what you mention,
> the misc. field for "weighting"(not sure if I quoted correctly) but my
> prev. post on time factoring..

	One hilight at a time, just as filters. I may make multiple
filters in the future, then allow colouration via filtr, and then ditch
hilights.. but we'll see.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Wed Sep 11, 2002 8:27pm
Subject: Sounds good Jeff !!! what about the "weighted" option, is that feasible ?

and if so, perhaps on a beta version would this show up

Thanks

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > Nah not yet, I'm getting my t615c in a few days but on my b&w 
t415 it 
> > does not give me an option to change a highlight color, ie. a 
light 
> > grey or some variation of grey, I've tested the highlight feature 
on 
> 
> 	Shadow doesn't support gray on mono units (ie: Since some old
> units can do gray, and others not, its a pain to do it well. So I 
didn't
> bother since on many units the gray just washes out anyway :/
> 
> > my old 610c and its super cool, way to go jeff, it would be cool 
if
> > for example,you can highlight this week's events and past due at 
the
> > same time(diff. colors of course) maybe this can be done I just
> > haven't messed with it yet. I'm looking forward to what you 
mention,
> > the misc. field for "weighting"(not sure if I quoted correctly) 
but my
> > prev. post on time factoring..
> 
> 	One hilight at a time, just as filters. I may make multiple
> filters in the future, then allow colouration via filtr, and then 
ditch
> hilights.. but we'll see.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: McMug  <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 3:30am
Subject: Re: suggestion: DB5 and SP again

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > Incidentally, PopupFreeTime only works with datebook and datebk3, 
> > not  datebk5. 
 
> DB5 lives inthe normal datebook database, so DB5 items should show
> up as well. If it showed ToDo items, that'd be cool.

Yes and no. PopupFreeTime can display db5 records, right. But it has 
a button to jump to datebook or db3 to edit a selected appt. Perhaps 
to directly add new appts as well, I don't know. Anyway, the function 
is not available for db5.

Note my other post (#7100) on daApptView.

From: bobthepreacher  <lcc@b...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 6:49pm
Subject: Re: suggestion: DB5 and SP again

I think that this is the first time I have responded onthis 
group. . .butI feel akin to the discussion. 

A couple of things:
1) I can't remember where I read it (documentation for Lotus 
Approach?)but one of the best suggestions I have ever had for 
organizing data in any kind of a data base (which shadow, is in a 
way) is sitting down with paper and pencil and deciding exactly what 
it is you want the data base to do, track, follow or account for. It 
might not actually take paper. . .but much of what goes into an 
effective plan, or the effective use of planning tools, is deciding 
what and how they will be used for. A lot of the questions or 
solutions in this thread are of the "I'm in the middle of something 
good. . .IF I could just figure out how to get to my information." 
type. 
2) Shadow is more of a META or "big-picture" tool. DB5 organizes the 
daily/weekly details of how to accomplish the big picture. To try and 
manage/juggle the daily details of life in a SP outline would not 
only consume more time than it saves or manages, you would wind up 
with daily outlines impossibly huge.
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "McMug" <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...> 
wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > > Incidentally, PopupFreeTime only works with datebook and 
datebk3, 
> > > not  datebk5. 
>  
> > DB5 lives inthe normal datebook database, so DB5 items should show
> > up as well. If it showed ToDo items, that'd be cool.
> 
> Yes and no. PopupFreeTime can display db5 records, right. But it 
has 
> a button to jump to datebook or db3 to edit a selected appt. 
Perhaps 
> to directly add new appts as well, I don't know. Anyway, the 
function 
> is not available for db5.
> 
> Note my other post (#7100) on daApptView.

From: Sharon Carleton  <scarlet_vx@y...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 7:34pm
Subject: Lost Data

Lost all but two entries on my 2 primary work lists
during HotSync. An error was generated on the computer
while Shadow was being processed and HotSync shut
down.  No evidence of bad connection.  Resync seemed
OK but today I find no, my data is gone.  Hope to
recover most thru BackupBuddy tonight but I am
freaked.  I am mainly wanting to know what could have
gone wrong so it doesn't happen again.
Lists acted normal on Clie beforehand.  I had done a
number of clipping operations from one to the other. 
Today the contents showed 59 entries but there were
only 2 when I opened the list.  Later the contents
screen changed to 2.  Any advice is appreciated.  Hard
to make this the primary trusted system when this
happens!  Thanks.  Sharon
--- Scarlet@N... <Scarlet@N...>
wrote:
> Lost nearly all the entries on my two primary
working lists during HotSync.
> A HotSync error was generated at the Shadow point
and the HotSync manager
> shut down.  No idea why.  Repeat HotSync appeared to
work, but today I find,
> no, my data is gone.  No indication that the
connection was broken.  Hope to
> recover most of my entries through BackupBuddy
tonight, but I am freaked
> (and making an attempt to email from work).  I am
primarily concerned with
> what could have gone wrong?  Lists behaved normally
on the Clie beforehand.
> I had done a number of transfers between the two
lists.  This morning (when
> I opened the program again) the "table of contents"
said I had 59 entries
> but when I opened there were only two.  After
opening and closing a few
> times the contents switched to 2 entries as well. 
Any advice is
> appreciated!  Hard to make this my primary trusted
system if this is going
> to happen.


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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: forlistsonly  <forlistsonly@y...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 7:43pm
Subject: Hot syn error

I don't know if this is in the archives, but I have checked the FAQ 
and manual.  I have started receiving a hot-syn error that actually 
crashes the entire sync process.  Any ideas on how to fix this?

Thanks,
SD

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:03pm
Subject: Re: Lost Data

On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Sharon Carleton wrote:

> Lost all but two entries on my 2 primary work lists during HotSync. An
> error was generated on the computer while Shadow was being processed
> and HotSync shut down.  No evidence of bad connection.  Resync seemed
> OK but today I find no, my data is gone.  Hope to recover most thru
> BackupBuddy tonight but I am freaked.  I am mainly wanting to know
> what could have gone wrong so it doesn't happen again. Lists acted
> normal on Clie beforehand.  I had done a number of clipping operations
> from one to the other.  Today the contents showed 59 entries but there
> were only 2 when I opened the list.  Later the contents screen changed
> to 2.  Any advice is appreciated.  Hard to make this the primary
> trusted system when this happens!  Thanks.  Sharon

	If a crash occurs at exactly the wrong time in Shadow conduit, bad
stuff can happen :/ It is generally pretty rare for such a thign to cocur,
but it does happen. I hope to get a fix out, but I'm being delayed right
now :/

	BackupBuddy if done recently will have your data.

	Shadow Desktop keeps 3 or 4 backups, so likely also has yuor data.
Check the Desktop Ref for details, but you shoudl be able to find your
Backup directory with a bunch of backups in it, and restore them. (ie:
DFor instance, you may find your Shadow Desktop file is still good, and
then its easy to restoer your handheld. If the .xml file is also
corrupted, then check your Backup directory for a .0 or .1 or .2 file..
those can be restored, too)

	Lastly, if you have the pre-truncated palm file, then the data can
be extracted from there. Send me the file.

	So depends what stae you're in right now.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:04pm
Subject: Re: Hot syn error

On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, forlistsonly wrote:

> I don't know if this is in the archives, but I have checked the FAQ 
> and manual.  I have started receiving a hot-syn error that actually 
> crashes the entire sync process.  Any ideas on how to fix this?

	Specifying the error usually helps ;)

	Do a file find for lastsync.txt; in the same location are yuor
desktop XML files.. move them somewhere else, and a fresh synch should fix
you up.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Sharon Carleton  <scarlet_vx@y...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:09pm
Subject:

Lost nearly all the entries on my two primary working
lists during HotSync.  A HotSync error was generated
at the Shadow point and the HotSync manager shut down.
 No idea why.  Repeat HotSync appeared to work, but
today I find, no, my data is gone.  No indication that
the connection was broken.  Hope to recover most of my
entries through BackupBuddy tonight, but I am freaked
(and making an attempt to email from work).  I am
primarily concerned with what could have gone wrong? 
Lists behaved normally on the Clie beforehand.  I had
done a number of transfers between the two lists. 
This morning (when I opened the program again) the
"table of contents" said I had 59 entries but when I
opened there were only two.  After opening and closing
a few times the contents switched to 2 entries as
well.  Any advice is appreciated!  Hard to make this
my primary trusted system if this is going to happen. 
Thanks.  Sharon

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From: Craig  <cdemouy@m...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:40pm
Subject: duplicate enteries

Jeff,

I sync on two computers and every changed line is duplicated.  I am 
really getting tied of deleting the dupicates.  Can you P L E A S E 
change the code to not do this?

Thanks!

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Sep 12, 2002 8:55pm
Subject: Re: duplicate enteries

On Thu, 12 Sep 2002, Craig wrote:

> I sync on two computers and every changed line is duplicated.  I am
> really getting tied of deleting the dupicates.  Can you P L E A S E
> change the code to not do this?

	Upcoming version is smarter about how it tries to deal with
unknown or paranoid situations.

	You know, I should just make one for the short term that when you
synch on a "different" desktop, it just downloads the files from the
handheld.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Sharon Carleton  <scarlet_vx@y...>
Date: Fri Sep 13, 2002 2:09am
Subject: Re: Lost Data - Update

Jeff, I still have no idea WHY this happened but I
wanted to thank you for the very, very user friendly
backup and restore system you have established for
your desktop software.  Now that I'm back at home and
properly synced I'm back in business.  If you have any
input into why the crash might have occurred, great. 
May have been a memory thing on the PC?  The exact
error was that HotSync has caused a fault in Windows
explorer and will shut down. Not much to go on. 
Perhaps just a coincidence that Shadow was
synchronizing at the time.  Anyway, great backup
design.  Sharon
 
--- "Carleton, Sharon [NEUUS]" <Scarlet@N...>
wrote:
> Lost nearly all the entries on my two primary
> working lists during HotSync.
> A HotSync error was generated at the Shadow point
> and the HotSync manager
> shut down.  No idea why.  Repeat HotSync appeared to
> work, but today I find,
> no, my data is gone.  No indication that the
> connection was broken.  Hope to
> recover most of my entries through BackupBuddy
> tonight, but I am freaked
> (and making an attempt to email from work).  I am
> primarily concerned with
> what could have gone wrong?  Lists behaved normally
> on the Clie beforehand.
> I had done a number of transfers between the two
> lists.  This morning (when
> I opened the program again) the "table of contents"
> said I had 59 entries
> but when I opened there were only two.  After
> opening and closing a few
> times the contents switched to 2 entries as well. 
> Any advice is
> appreciated!  Hard to make this my primary trusted
> system if this is going
> to happen.
> 


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From: scarlet_vx  <scarlet_vx@y...>
Date: Fri Sep 13, 2002 2:21am
Subject: Re: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

I have a highlight request.  Some applications allow you to color the 
background as well, not just change the color of the font.  Since I'm 
using a high-res display and teeny tiny print, it's hard to make 
highlighted fonts in Shadow really stand out in most cases.  (I'm one 
of the poor souls whose font size preferences won't stick).  I 
primarily use highlighting to make entries fade into the background 
rather than stand out.  It's just an idea, but the ability to color 
in the background would be great.

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Wed, 11 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > Nah not yet, I'm getting my t615c in a few days but on my b&w 
t415 it 
> > does not give me an option to change a highlight color, ie. a 
light 
> > grey or some variation of grey, I've tested the highlight feature 
on 
> 
> 	Shadow doesn't support gray on mono units (ie: Since some old
> units can do gray, and others not, its a pain to do it well. So I 
didn't
> bother since on many units the gray just washes out anyway :/
> 
> > my old 610c and its super cool, way to go jeff, it would be cool 
if
> > for example,you can highlight this week's events and past due at 
the
> > same time(diff. colors of course) maybe this can be done I just
> > haven't messed with it yet. I'm looking forward to what you 
mention,
> > the misc. field for "weighting"(not sure if I quoted correctly) 
but my
> > prev. post on time factoring..
> 
> 	One hilight at a time, just as filters. I may make multiple
> filters in the future, then allow colouration via filtr, and then 
ditch
> hilights.. but we'll see.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: tsuchy  <tsuchy@y...>
Date: Fri Sep 13, 2002 7:23am
Subject: Non-Alphas in filenames

Hi,

I noticed that Shadow doesn't let me use periods ('.'), slashes ('/'),
and possibly other non-alphanumeric characters in filenames, but if i
use an app like T'Catalog and change them to include these characters,
they show up fine and Shadow deals with them correctly... is there a
reason for this, and is there any consideration in allowing Shadow to
create files with these characters?

If this is some kind of bizarre bug that only shows up on my device,
then my apologies. I'm using a Palm VIIx, OS 3.5.2, if it matters.

Thanks!
Tom Suchy

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Sep 13, 2002 11:58am
Subject: Re: Non-Alphas in filenames

On Fri, 13 Sep 2002, tsuchy wrote:

> I noticed that Shadow doesn't let me use periods ('.'), slashes ('/'),
> and possibly other non-alphanumeric characters in filenames, but if i
> use an app like T'Catalog and change them to include these characters,
> they show up fine and Shadow deals with them correctly... is there a
> reason for this, and is there any consideration in allowing Shadow to
> create files with these characters?

	The Palm OS doesn't care about the filename content, however the
desktop platforms people usually use certainly do care. As such, to make
everyones life easier (mine included ;), Shadow strips out various
"common" characters that annother desktop OSes, though not all. ie: On
Windows, putting "/", ",", ">", "*" etc in filenames is seriously
uncool. Unix will handle it, but then a user poking around will have a
harder time dealing with those files. On Mac OS9, its different characters
and on OSX its a combo of unix and OS9 limitations.

> If this is some kind of bizarre bug that only shows up on my device,
> then my apologies. I'm using a Palm VIIx, OS 3.5.2, if it matters.

	No bug :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Sep 13, 2002 0:00pm
Subject: Re: Re: Off Topic: How many color pda users out there currently take advantage off ....

On Fri, 13 Sep 2002, scarlet_vx wrote:

> I have a highlight request.  Some applications allow you to color the 
> background as well, not just change the color of the font.  Since I'm 
> using a high-res display and teeny tiny print, it's hard to make 
> highlighted fonts in Shadow really stand out in most cases.  (I'm one 
> of the poor souls whose font size preferences won't stick).  I 
> primarily use highlighting to make entries fade into the background 
> rather than stand out.  It's just an idea, but the ability to color 
> in the background would be great.

	Hilighting will get totally redone in awhile, time permitting..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Guilherme Luiz Aguiar Pedrosa  <guilherme.pedrosa@i...>
Date: Sat Sep 14, 2002 0:30am
Subject: Suggestions for the (maybe not in near future) weigthing field

Hello, Jeff!

I was thinking about your weight field and... I think 1-250 may 
be a tight range if you want to use it with a "minutes" 
precision. Using an hour as precision could make hard to "weight" 
items that require less than that. 
And it would be difficult also to interpretate the meaning of a 
166 hours or a 231 minutes parent.

My sugestion:
I don't know implementation details of SP, but I know you can 
represent a value up to 65536 with 2 bytes of information. If you 
think in minute precision, this means about 45 days of maximum 
duration. 
Then, I should be able to say if that weighting field is or is 
not a duration field and, if it is, I could see it already 
interpretated as '1h35' for 1 hour and 35 minutes, '1d12' for one 
day and twelve hours and so on.

I own a Palm III and I would not mind losing 2 byte per shadow 
item of my 2 MB memory to record this info (supposing it's stored 
like this).
About the "view as duration", I think this will be the most used 
way by the SP user, when looking at this field.

I know this may not come in a near future but... what do you 
think?

Thanks,
Guilherme.

From: Ken Latham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Sat Sep 14, 2002 4:56am
Subject: Re: Suggestions for the (maybe not in near future) weigthing field

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Guilherme Luiz Aguiar Pedrosa"
<guilherme.pedrosa@i...> wrote:
> Hello, Jeff!
> 
> I was thinking about your weight field and... I think 1-250 may 
> be a tight range if you want to use it with a "minutes" 
> precision. Using an hour as precision could make hard to "weight" 
> items that require less than that. 
> And it would be difficult also to interpretate the meaning of a 
> 166 hours or a 231 minutes parent.
> 
> My sugestion:
> I don't know implementation details of SP, but I know you can 
> represent a value up to 65536 with 2 bytes of information. If you 
> think in minute precision, this means about 45 days of maximum 
> duration. 
> Then, I should be able to say if that weighting field is or is 
> not a duration field and, if it is, I could see it already 
> interpretated as '1h35' for 1 hour and 35 minutes, '1d12' for one 
> day and twelve hours and so on.
> 
<snip>

I think I can agree with this in the general sense, but not
specifically geared toward time.  For example:

What about level of attention (or maybe difficulty).  If you are
managing tasks for several people and generally divide the work into
even time allotments amoung them, then you don't need time, you need
to attach how much of your time it will take to guide each effort. 
For me that's a factor of difficulty for the assignee.

What about cost?  Dollars and cents.  This seems obvious to me...

What about frequency of visitation (babysitting).  As in, how much
attention a client needs to have those "warm and fuzzies".  In fact in
this case, I might want to see the average "w&f" for all the projects
for that client instead of the sum.  This is not time spent,
necessarily, I have clients that just like to hear from me on a
regular basis, but not necessarily for any length of time.

I could spew out a few dozen more if I really thought about it... but
I think that makes my point.

Personally, I'd like to see ...

First pass:
(a) One weighting per item
(b) file level weighting display format spec.
(c) file level "summation" function choices (sum, average, mean, etc)

Second pass:  (I know Jeff, this is pushing it!)
(a) multiple weightings per item
(b) file level cross weight functions where the function is an
expression involving all (or some) of the weightings.
.... Ex. hours = f( est. code lines(c), difficulty(d), programmer
ability(a), number of people on project(n) )
.... where f = (c * d * (10 - a)) + (((c * d * (10-a))*.1) * n)
.... << not my *actual* formula, but you get the idea...>>
(c) multiple display formats (one for each weighting)
(d) parent level child summation function selection

Third pass: (now I'm really dreaming)
(a) multiple cross weighting functions per item (still file level
definition)
(b) multiple summation functions defined in terms of the individual
weightings and/or the function outcomes of the child cross weighting
functions.

just my 2 cents.. no 3 cents worth... :)

Ken

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Sat Sep 14, 2002 7:22pm
Subject: This would be awesome Re: Suggestions on weigthing field

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Guilherme Luiz Aguiar Pedrosa" 
<guilherme.pedrosa@i...> wrote:
> Hello, Jeff!
> 
> I was thinking about your weight field and... I think 1-250 may 
> be a tight range if you want to use it with a "minutes" 
> precision. Using an hour as precision could make hard to "weight" 
> items that require less than that. 
> And it would be difficult also to interpretate the meaning of a 
> 166 hours or a 231 minutes parent.
> 
> My sugestion:
> I don't know implementation details of SP, but I know you can 
> represent a value up to 65536 with 2 bytes of information. If you 
> think in minute precision, this means about 45 days of maximum 
> duration. 
> Then, I should be able to say if that weighting field is or is 
> not a duration field and, if it is, I could see it already 
> interpretated as '1h35' for 1 hour and 35 minutes, '1d12' for one 
> day and twelve hours and so on.
> 
> I own a Palm III and I would not mind losing 2 byte per shadow 
> item of my 2 MB memory to record this info (supposing it's stored 
> like this).
> About the "view as duration", I think this will be the most used 
> way by the SP user, when looking at this field.
> 
> I know this may not come in a near future but... what do you 
> think?
> 
> Thanks,
> Guilherme.

From: Bruce L. Van Buren  <yahoo@a...>
Date: Sun Sep 15, 2002 2:50am
Subject: HandEra support

I'd be very happy to send $$ if the next version has at least some 
HandEra support.  Anything more than a promise.

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Sun Sep 15, 2002 5:09am
Subject: Re: HandEra support

Acting without permission as Jeff's agent, I can promise you once the $100,000.00 check from you arrives and is cashed, there will be immediate work on the Handera support you desire!  ; )
Kevin
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bruce L. Van Buren 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Saturday, September 14, 2002 6:50 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] HandEra support


  I'd be very happy to send $$ if the next version has at least some 
  HandEra support.  Anything more than a promise.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Sun Sep 15, 2002 8:02am
Subject: Suggestion for next release re: View Manager

Hi Jeff, I don't know if someone may have suggested this already but 
here it goes just in case. When you view any saved view, 
ie "whatever you name" instead of it showing the list name in blue 
like it does know, it would be cool to have an option to get rid off 
that list name and instead replace it with the name of the view your 
currently using or something to that effect, that way you always see 
which custom save view your in, its easier to know which list your 
in than which view, imho

From: wbornstein  <wbornstein@a...>
Date: Sun Sep 15, 2002 2:48pm
Subject: Templates

I've been using SP for my action list for the past few weeks.  The 
main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set up  
templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context 
(e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  Perhaps these 
features are there, and I've overlooked them.  Without a template, 
there are just too many steps to set up each entry.  Any suggestions?

From: McMug  <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:43am
Subject: Re: Templates

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "wbornstein" <wbornstein@a...> wrote:
> The main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set up  
> templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context 
> (e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  

My circumvention is to create an SP list of templates, and use the 
clipboard send-to-file to put them into my active list. The to-do 
link you need has to be added manually though.

From: pfieldho_99  <pfieldho_99@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 4:56am
Subject: Re: Templates

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "McMug" <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...> 
wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "wbornstein" <wbornstein@a...> wrote:
> > The main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set up  
> > templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context 
> > (e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  
> 
> My circumvention is to create an SP list of templates, and use the 
> clipboard send-to-file to put them into my active list. The to-do 
> link you need has to be added manually though.

Wouldn't it be easier to duplicate your "SP list of templates" and 
use that to start your new list(s)? Then all you would have to do is 
copy the appropriate template item within the same list rather than 
copying it from one list to another.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:17pm
Subject: Re: Suggestions for the (maybe not in near future) weigthing field

On Sat, 14 Sep 2002, Guilherme Luiz Aguiar Pedrosa wrote:

> be a tight range if you want to use it with a "minutes" 
> precision. Using an hour as precision could make hard to "weight" 
> items that require less than that. 

	I'm imagingnig a unsigned 16bit value as yuo guess, but the UI is
the other side of the coin; I am envisioning a sort of entry box where you
can use a slider bar to pick 1-250, or a field to enter in a number.

> Then, I should be able to say if that weighting field is or is not a
> duration field and, if it is, I could see it already interpretated as
> '1h35' for 1 hour and 35 minutes, '1d12' for one day and twelve hours
> and so on.

	Hmm. So you want a "display type" field as well, so it can be a
raw number, or hours, or days, or weight (like grams), etc. Hmm.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:19pm
Subject: Re: HandEra support

On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, Bruce L. Van Buren wrote:

> I'd be very happy to send $$ if the next version has at least some 
> HandEra support.  Anything more than a promise.

	VFS works fine on Handera ;)

	I hope to return to normalacy soon (start writing off losses due
to companies being shitty, rather than fight with them more :/), so need
to re-evaluate priorities and targets. (ie: Now that OS5 is looming so
close, I need to push up the OS5 testing a lot more, and gt some
compatability code in there quick. And the conduit needs a major overhaul
ASAP. *shrug*)

	TBD.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:22pm
Subject: Re: Suggestion for next release re: View Manager

On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> Hi Jeff, I don't know if someone may have suggested this already but 
> here it goes just in case. When you view any saved view, 
> ie "whatever you name" instead of it showing the list name in blue 
> like it does know, it would be cool to have an option to get rid off 
> that list name and instead replace it with the name of the view your 
> currently using or something to that effect, that way you always see 
> which custom save view your in, its easier to know which list your 
> in than which view, imho

	Filename must be shown, since you could easily turn your unit off
for an hour and turn it on and not recall which file your' in. (ie: View
is shared across files, so that doesn't help). I have thought of showing
it in various ways.. but its a toughie to decide. ie: Tapping on the
filename brings pulldown menus out on mos units.. but I coudl build
somethign so that if you tap on the far left of the filename, it toggles
to show the view instead.. or perhaps make a toggle somewhere on the far
lef tor right of the titlebar to toggle the tbar to show the view and
filter and sort.. but then, the tbar is all-button already, so it woudl be
hard to do..

	If you've got a good idea, let me knkow ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:24pm
Subject: Re: Templates

On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, wbornstein wrote:

> I've been using SP for my action list for the past few weeks.  The 
> main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set up  
> templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context 
> (e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  Perhaps these 
> features are there, and I've overlooked them.  Without a template, 
> there are just too many steps to set up each entry.  Any suggestions?

	You'd have to define what you mean (exactly) by templates..

	Most people mean "Template" to mean "files they can copy
easily". In which case you can (say):

	o) Keep a Shadow category full of tempate files, and then use
'Duplicate' to copy them

	o) Make a file called "Templates", and keep common items in
it. Even tag them to make them easier to find. Then use Clipboard to Copy
and Send-To and Clear, to ship off copied items to other files.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:52pm
Subject: Re: Suggestion for next release re: View Manager

Jeff how about making the list show up with a smaller font and next 
to it the view name and it would switch as you toggle between your 
diff saved view. 



--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > Hi Jeff, I don't know if someone may have suggested this already 
but 
> > here it goes just in case. When you view any saved view, 
> > ie "whatever you name" instead of it showing the list name in 
blue 
> > like it does know, it would be cool to have an option to get rid 
off 
> > that list name and instead replace it with the name of the view 
your 
> > currently using or something to that effect, that way you always 
see 
> > which custom save view your in, its easier to know which list 
your 
> > in than which view, imho
> 
> 	Filename must be shown, since you could easily turn your unit 
off
> for an hour and turn it on and not recall which file your' in. (ie: 
View
> is shared across files, so that doesn't help). I have thought of 
showing
> it in various ways.. but its a toughie to decide. ie: Tapping on the
> filename brings pulldown menus out on mos units.. but I coudl build
> somethign so that if you tap on the far left of the filename, it 
toggles
> to show the view instead.. or perhaps make a toggle somewhere on 
the far
> lef tor right of the titlebar to toggle the tbar to show the view 
and
> filter and sort.. but then, the tbar is all-button already, so it 
woudl be
> hard to do..
> 
> 	If you've got a good idea, let me knkow ;)
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 3:54pm
Subject: Great idea: Slide Bar Re: Suggestions for the weigthing field

how about a slide bar a la Bug Me something like that were one inputs 
some preset time and if one needs to you can customize for whatever 
time you want..

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Sat, 14 Sep 2002, Guilherme Luiz Aguiar Pedrosa wrote:
> 
> > be a tight range if you want to use it with a "minutes" 
> > precision. Using an hour as precision could make hard to "weight" 
> > items that require less than that. 
> 
> 	I'm imagingnig a unsigned 16bit value as yuo guess, but the 
UI is
> the other side of the coin; I am envisioning a sort of entry box 
where you
> can use a slider bar to pick 1-250, or a field to enter in a number.
> 
> > Then, I should be able to say if that weighting field is or is 
not a
> > duration field and, if it is, I could see it already 
interpretated as
> > '1h35' for 1 hour and 35 minutes, '1d12' for one day and twelve 
hours
> > and so on.
> 
> 	Hmm. So you want a "display type" field as well, so it can be 
a
> raw number, or hours, or days, or weight (like grams), etc. Hmm.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: McMug  <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 4:07pm
Subject: Re: Templates

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "pfieldho_99" <pfieldho_99@y...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "McMug" <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...> 
> wrote:
> > --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "wbornstein" <wbornstein@a...> wrote:
> > > The main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set 
up  
> > > templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context 
> > > (e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  
> > 
> > My circumvention is to create an SP list of templates, and use 
the 
> > clipboard send-to-file to put them into my active list. The to-do 
> > link you need has to be added manually though.
> 
> Wouldn't it be easier to duplicate your "SP list of templates" and 
> use that to start your new list(s)? Then all you would have to do 
> is copy the appropriate template item within the same list rather 
> than copying it from one list to another.

No. the point of the template is it contains a lot of useful list 
items. Things I do from time to time. I add selected items to my main 
list and adjust the start date. The text and tags and priority serves 
as defaults to the new item created.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 4:10pm
Subject: Re: Re: Suggestion for next release re: View Manager

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> Jeff how about making the list show up with a smaller font and next 
> to it the view name and it would switch as you toggle between your 
> diff saved view. 

	The "tab" where the filename is is a system function provided by
the OS. We dont' mess with it. (You can, but its seriosuly uncool and
asking for trouble)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 5:03pm
Subject: Re: Suggestion for next release re: View Manager

ah ok, but I'm sure you'll come up with something cool, you always 
do, anything will do as long as you see easily which view one is in 
but the weighting feature IMHO is more need than knowing the saved 
view name... weighing will spice SP even more I think, looking 
forward to the next beta release already.

thanks

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > Jeff how about making the list show up with a smaller font and 
next 
> > to it the view name and it would switch as you toggle between 
your 
> > diff saved view. 
> 
> 	The "tab" where the filename is is a system function provided 
by
> the OS. We dont' mess with it. (You can, but its seriosuly uncool 
and
> asking for trouble)
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: smasters@a...
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 6:00pm
Subject: Re: Templates

I think what the original poster was getting at was not a template file,
but a predetermined tag or list of tags to be applied. I too struggled with
getting new items tagged correctly until I did two things:

1. per Jeff, set up my filters to include items that had no tag. That way
no matter what filter is applied you can see what still needs to be tagged.
THe "inbox within the inbox" where I am concerned. There's a post to
"Shadow Tips" with more detail.
2. I know this is Discuss, but using a new alpha has also helped, because
it has 2 tap tagging.

As far as the Todo's, I set up my inbox so all new items are linked to
todo, category inbox. Then I have the ToDo link displayed in a custom view,
so I can get rid of the few links I don't want with one tap each.

Hope this helps.

Scott


                                                                                                                   
                    "wbornstein"                                                                                   
                    <wbornstein@a...        To:     shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com                                    
                    ttbi.com>            cc:                                                                       
                                         Subject:     [shadow-discuss] Templates                                   
                    09/15/2002                                                                                     
                    09:48 AM                                                                                       
                    Please                                                                                         
                    respond to                                                                                     
                    shadow-discus                                                                                  
                    s                                                                                              
                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                   




I've been using SP for my action list for the past few weeks.  The
main shortcoming I'm encountering is the inability to set up
templates that tag new entries to the appropriate context
(e.g., "work") and links them to my to do database.  Perhaps these
features are there, and I've overlooked them.  Without a template,
there are just too many steps to set up each entry.  Any suggestions?

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 6:12pm
Subject: Re: Templates

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002 smasters@a... wrote:

> 2. I know this is Discuss, but using a new alpha has also helped, because
> it has 2 tap tagging.

	I posted the URL (as a beta) last week to the 2.5.6 alpha, so I
consider it "available".

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 7:06pm
Subject: Linking to the Datebook

I just realized when you link to the datebook(in my case dbk5) you 
can't select the category nor the time of the appt is that coming 
soon ? TIA

From: yoohoocity  <alsiders203@a...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:14pm
Subject: Re: Linking to the Datebook

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "jledesma28" <jledesma28@y...> wrote:
> I just realized when you link to the datebook(in my case dbk5) you 
> can't select the category nor the time of the appt is that coming 
> soon ? TIA


The category support (or lack of it) is probably due to the fact that 
the built-in datebook database does not have any category support.  
It was added to DateBk 3/4/5.  So while you can tell Shadow to launch 
DateBk5 when following a link, the setup of the link is still 
dependent on the limitations of the built-in datebook (i.e. no 
categories).  It would be great to have it (and time selection), but 
category selection would be pretty much app-specific to DateBk5 and 
as Jeff states he tries not to do anything app-specific unless 
absolutely necessary.  Then, again I could be wrong about all of this.

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:21pm
Subject: Re: Linking to the Datebook

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> I just realized when you link to the datebook(in my case dbk5) you 
> can't select the category nor the time of the appt is that coming 
> soon ? TIA

	"Category" is not a standard datebook database attribute; it is
DB5 only. Shadow sticks very closely to the standards (I've got enough to
do following the standards, without supporting each little extension that
thousands of Palm apps have done ;) However, that is why you have link
"goto' and many ways to easily jump back to Shadow.. you can create the
link, then do a goto and see your item ni DB5, then do a "Return" (hit
Home, if yuo've enabled that option in Shadow), or use ShadowLinkHack, or
use various Hacks, to jump back to Shadow.  Setting the time, the category
in DB5, or an alarm, is done this way.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:36pm
Subject: Thanks for your response Re: Linking to the Datebook

thanks for the response I had no idea, yes I know SP hack and the 
goto I just thought it was something simple but you're absolutely 
correct you can't cater your app to match every other app out there, 
Shadow still rules no matter what, can't wait for "sibling tags" and 
weighing to come along, thanks guys



--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > I just realized when you link to the datebook(in my case dbk5) 
you 
> > can't select the category nor the time of the appt is that coming 
> > soon ? TIA
> 
> 	"Category" is not a standard datebook database attribute; it 
is
> DB5 only. Shadow sticks very closely to the standards (I've got 
enough to
> do following the standards, without supporting each little 
extension that
> thousands of Palm apps have done ;) However, that is why you have 
link
> "goto' and many ways to easily jump back to Shadow.. you can create 
the
> link, then do a goto and see your item ni DB5, then do a "Return" 
(hit
> Home, if yuo've enabled that option in Shadow), or use 
ShadowLinkHack, or
> use various Hacks, to jump back to Shadow.  Setting the time, the 
category
> in DB5, or an alarm, is done this way.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Michael Davidson  <mdavids+yahoo@b...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:38pm
Subject: Re: Re: Linking to the Datebook

On Mon, 16  2002, yoohoocity (alsiders203@a...) wrote:
> 
> The category support (or lack of it) is probably due to the fact that 
> the built-in datebook database does not have any category support.  

If I recall the DateBk docs correctly, this is not technically true. The
built-in database does have category support, but the built-in datebook
applicatoin chooses not to use the capability.  DateBk uses it, but it's
there in the database no matter what app you're using.

Michael

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:46pm
Subject: Re: Thanks for your response Re: Linking to the Datebook

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:

> correct you can't cater your app to match every other app out there, 
> Shadow still rules no matter what, can't wait for "sibling tags" and 
> weighing to come along, thanks guys

	Guys? Nope, just me :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 8:49pm
Subject: Re: Re: Linking to the Datebook

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, Michael Davidson wrote:

> > The category support (or lack of it) is probably due to the fact that 
> > the built-in datebook database does not have any category support.  
> 
> If I recall the DateBk docs correctly, this is not technically true. The
> built-in database does have category support, but the built-in datebook
> applicatoin chooses not to use the capability.  DateBk uses it, but it's
> there in the database no matter what app you're using.

<OverComplexCommentary>
	Correct; Palm OS databases have records, and a record has an
attribute block, and one of the attributes is category. This is a very
small bitmask which is why categories are limited to 0-15, and why every
record in a Palm OS database *can* support categories. However, its up to
the applications to understand them and to work with them (proper sorting,
UI, etc etc). So it is not correct to say DaetBook (the built in
application) ignores what is there.. it just doesn't support categories,
which are a little easier in Palm OS databases than they otherwise might
be.
</OverComplexCommentary>

	(ie: You could say Quake3 choses not to support Word Doc writing
by the same gesture.. that doesn't make Quake3 incorrect)

	(Sorry, just feeling pedantic ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 9:22pm
Subject: Right on, I know you're the man !!!

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, jledesma28 wrote:
> 
> > correct you can't cater your app to match every other app out 
there, 
> > Shadow still rules no matter what, can't wait for "sibling tags" 
and 
> > weighing to come along, thanks guys
> 
> 	Guys? Nope, just me :)
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: andrewstuartallen  <andrewstuartallen@y...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 6:04am
Subject: Beaming Tags?

Forgive me if this is a naive question for I am a newbie...
But is it possible to beam tags along with a list? I've tried beaming 
a tagged list to my fiancee's Palm and the tags end up as broken 
links at her end, even though she has the same list of tags in her 
tag manager as I do.
Thanks for any tips....
Andy Allen

From: Steve Clarke  <sclarke@f...>
Date: Mon Sep 16, 2002 10:57pm
Subject: Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

At the risk of being a creep.

If we all take a step back änd look at all the inexpensive software we 
use on palm devices which help makes us to be much more efficient in our 
professional lives and consider the value for money. I for one will have 
no problem in justifying paying £20.00 per year for a upgrade to shadow. 
It will have paid for itself within the first couple of  months.

Jeff Mitchell wrote:

> To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
> From: Jeff Mitchell <support@s...>
> Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 11:19:44 -0400 (EDT)
> Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] HandEra support
> 
> On Sun, 15 Sep 2002, Bruce L. Van Buren wrote:
> 
>> I'd be very happy to send $$ if the next version has at least some
>> HandEra support.  Anything more than a promise.
> 
> 	VFS works fine on Handera ;)
> 
> 	I hope to return to normalacy soon (start writing off losses due
> to companies being shitty, rather than fight with them more :/), so need
> to re-evaluate priorities and targets. (ie: Now that OS5 is looming so
> close, I need to push up the OS5 testing a lot more, and gt some
> compatability code in there quick. And the conduit needs a major overhaul
> ASAP. *shrug*)
> 
> 	TBD.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
> 
> 
> 
Steve Clarke


sclarke.@f...

sent from a palm

From: Anthony Schellenberg  <aschell2000@h...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 0:57pm
Subject: Re: Beaming Tags?

There is a separate tag database.  You could use an app like Filez to beem
the database, but that would replace any tags that the other person has.  I
haven't tried this, so I'm not sure what the results would be.

----- Original Message -----
From: "andrewstuartallen"
> Forgive me if this is a naive question for I am a newbie...
> But is it possible to beam tags along with a list? I've

From: fiatspider72  <jphillips@p...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 1:43pm
Subject: Re: Linking to the Datebook

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 	(Sorry, just feeling pedantic ;)

Ah, new word.  Had to look it up:

(From Dictionary.com)

pe·dan·tic   adj.

Characterized by a narrow, often ostentatious concern for book
learning and formal rules: a pedantic attention to details. 

 - Jeramy

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 2:10pm
Subject: Piki and PowerJog

Just an FYI, for those using Piki with a Clie. The newest MegaWiki beta
should support PowerJog, so you can start using that to launch Piki instead
of being forced to use EasyLaunch.

Scott

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 2:52pm
Subject: Re: Beaming Tags?

On Tue, 17 Sep 2002, andrewstuartallen wrote:

> Forgive me if this is a naive question for I am a newbie...
> But is it possible to beam tags along with a list? I've tried beaming 
> a tagged list to my fiancee's Palm and the tags end up as broken 
> links at her end, even though she has the same list of tags in her 
> tag manager as I do.

	You'd have to beam your tag database over to her, though the side
effect would be that it would clobber her tag database. (Which is why I
did not include an option to beam it.. too dangerous. Beaming of
individual tags is not yet supported and can be very complex). If she
doesn't use tags, you can safely send yours over.. by usnig a 3rd party
file maanger or some launchers.. you'll just beam over your ShadTags
file..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 2:55pm
Subject: Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, Steve Clarke wrote:

> At the risk of being a creep.
> 
> If we all take a step back änd look at all the inexpensive software we 
> use on palm devices which help makes us to be much more efficient in our 
> professional lives and consider the value for money. I for one will have 
> no problem in justifying paying £20.00 per year for a upgrade to shadow. 
> It will have paid for itself within the first couple of  months.

	Sadly, I'm a victom of conscience and good will; from the onset, I
wished to provide not just good value (cheap software), but kille value
(unlimited updates). Its a business mdoel that one can live with getting
new customers (and given the Palm OS market is sufficiently large, this
works). Being a man of honour means I don't take back on my word..

	I am, however, tempted to be the jerk and make Shadow 3.0 require
an update fee and thereafter have subscriptions or the like. However, I
can't say anything since Iv'e put zero thought towards it, and it sickens
me to think about it ;)

	Raising the price of the base uintis is also an option, withotu
renigging on my prior words. (ie: Also, ocne can assume context.. if you
purchased 2 years ago, you probabyl dont' mind paying a update fee, as
I've obviously done my time in free updates over the years).

	*shrug*

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 5:37pm
Subject: Yep it works awesome !!!Re: Piki and PowerJog

another fyi, you can use K-launch as well, pretty convenient, put 
your piki conf. relating to SP and boom all your list will be 
available, I noticed though that when you bring up SP thru Piki, 
either PowerJog, Easylaunch, or K-launch and you're using lubaks 
fonts or any swiz14, when you go to SP thru any of the aforementioned 
DA's it won't automatically give you the SP list with your selected 
fonts, ie, handera 18B or whatever you choose, but if you have a Clie 
if you hit the back button then magically it turns to your selected 
fonts so its kind of cool, but still fyi for you Clie users out there

Clie's rule


--- In shadow-discuss@y..., smasters@a... wrote:
> 
> Just an FYI, for those using Piki with a Clie. The newest MegaWiki 
beta
> should support PowerJog, so you can start using that to launch Piki 
instead
> of being forced to use EasyLaunch.
> 
> Scott

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 6:41pm
Subject: Re: Yep it works awesome !!!Re: Piki and PowerJog

Wow, thanks for the tip on the back button. I have played around with
setting all the apps up individually, trying to get this right. The back
button fix will really help.

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Tue Sep 17, 2002 8:42pm
Subject: That's reasonable Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

its not far fetch to ask current user for a nominal upgrade fee ie. 
$5.00 or something to receive SP 3.0 and subsequent major releases, 
why not Jackflash current registration is only for 6 months, thinkdb 
is 1year and others alike, it makes good business sense IMHO

good apps like this one don't come everyday and as it gets better we 
become more and more dependant on them, wait and see when the desktop 
comes around at least to 2.5.1 standards how you're sales will 
increase, I'm sure of it, word of mouth goes a long way in sales, 
keep up the good work, IMO dbk5 and SP are the best PIM apps out there

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, Steve Clarke wrote:
> 
> > At the risk of being a creep.
> > 
> > If we all take a step back änd look at all the inexpensive 
software we 
> > use on palm devices which help makes us to be much more efficient 
in our 
> > professional lives and consider the value for money. I for one 
will have 
> > no problem in justifying paying £20.00 per year for a upgrade to 
shadow. 
> > It will have paid for itself within the first couple of  months.
> 
> 	Sadly, I'm a victom of conscience and good will; from the 
onset, I
> wished to provide not just good value (cheap software), but kille 
value
> (unlimited updates). Its a business mdoel that one can live with 
getting
> new customers (and given the Palm OS market is sufficiently large, 
this
> works). Being a man of honour means I don't take back on my word..
> 
> 	I am, however, tempted to be the jerk and make Shadow 3.0 
require
> an update fee and thereafter have subscriptions or the like. 
However, I
> can't say anything since Iv'e put zero thought towards it, and it 
sickens
> me to think about it ;)
> 
> 	Raising the price of the base uintis is also an option, 
withotu
> renigging on my prior words. (ie: Also, ocne can assume context.. 
if you
> purchased 2 years ago, you probabyl dont' mind paying a update fee, 
as
> I've obviously done my time in free updates over the years).
> 
> 	*shrug*
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: clieguy  <clieguy@y...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 1:12am
Subject: That's reasonable Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

I certainly wouldn't mind paying an upgrade fee for 3.0. That is 
providing you get the desktop piece working good.

Lord knows Dataviz doesn't have a problem socking us with $30 upgrade 
fees for DocToGo.

I know you promised free upgrades in the beginning...but you have 
done so much to make SP fantastic, that I don't see a problem with an 
upgrade fee. You have gone above and beyond the call of duty in 
supporting and constantly improving SP.

Just MHO.

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "jledesma28" <jledesma28@y...> wrote:
> its not far fetch to ask current user for a nominal upgrade fee ie. 
> $5.00 or something to receive SP 3.0 and subsequent major releases, 
> why not Jackflash current registration is only for 6 months, 
thinkdb 
> is 1year and others alike, it makes good business sense IMHO
> 
> good apps like this one don't come everyday and as it gets better 
we 
> become more and more dependant on them, wait and see when the 
desktop 
> comes around at least to 2.5.1 standards how you're sales will 
> increase, I'm sure of it, word of mouth goes a long way in sales, 
> keep up the good work, IMO dbk5 and SP are the best PIM apps out 
there
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > On Mon, 16 Sep 2002, Steve Clarke wrote:
> > 
> > > At the risk of being a creep.
> > > 
> > > If we all take a step back änd look at all the inexpensive 
> software we 
> > > use on palm devices which help makes us to be much more 
efficient 
> in our 
> > > professional lives and consider the value for money. I for one 
> will have 
> > > no problem in justifying paying £20.00 per year for a upgrade 
to 
> shadow. 
> > > It will have paid for itself within the first couple of  months.
> > 
> > 	Sadly, I'm a victom of conscience and good will; from the 
> onset, I
> > wished to provide not just good value (cheap software), but kille 
> value
> > (unlimited updates). Its a business mdoel that one can live with 
> getting
> > new customers (and given the Palm OS market is sufficiently 
large, 
> this
> > works). Being a man of honour means I don't take back on my word..
> > 
> > 	I am, however, tempted to be the jerk and make Shadow 3.0 
> require
> > an update fee and thereafter have subscriptions or the like. 
> However, I
> > can't say anything since Iv'e put zero thought towards it, and it 
> sickens
> > me to think about it ;)
> > 
> > 	Raising the price of the base uintis is also an option, 
> withotu
> > renigging on my prior words. (ie: Also, ocne can assume context.. 
> if you
> > purchased 2 years ago, you probabyl dont' mind paying a update 
fee, 
> as
> > I've obviously done my time in free updates over the years).
> > 
> > 	*shrug*
> > 
> > 		jeff
> > 
> > --
> > "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
> micro
> > circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> > sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
> is?"
> > -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 5:24am
Subject: New poll for shadow-discuss

Enter your vote today!  A new poll has been created for the 
shadow-discuss group:

Instead of setting a schedule, like
yearly, most people (I think) would
prefer to see a "pay for performance"
basis. So this is the way this poll is
structured, value per major upgrade.  It
would be up to Jeff what constitues a
"major" upgrade.
So... How much is SP worth to you?
 

  o $1.00 
  o $2.50 
  o $5.00 
  o $7.50 
  o $10.00 
  o $12.50 
  o $15.00 
  o $20.00 
  o $25.00 
  o $30.00 


To vote, please visit the following web page:

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss/surveys?id=978949  

Note: Please do not reply to this message. Poll votes are 
not collected via email. To vote, you must go to the Yahoo! Groups 
web site listed above.

Thanks!

From: Ken Latham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 5:34am
Subject: "Value of SP" Poll - from its creator

All,

Since Jeff would not take it upon himself to ask, I think we should
all volunteer the information for him.  To that end, I created a poll
to let Jeff know that Shadow Plan is worth a lot more than he's ever
asked anyone to pay.

Yearly subscriptions are a real drag since you never really know just
how much you'll get for your money.  So I'm assuming that most people
would want to pay for improvements.  Yes, this leaves us at Jeff's
mecry, but isn't that really the case anyway?  The poll is priced
according to "major" upgrade, and I, for one, am perfectly willing to
let Jeff define "major".

P.S. I did not include a $0 amount, because SP is either worth
something to you, or you ought to just delete it from your Palm right
now.

Ken

From: blazekrick  <richard@r...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 7:26am
Subject: Re: "Value of SP" Poll - from its creator

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Ken Latham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
>  So I'm assuming that most people
> would want to pay for improvements.  

I, for one, am finding the idea of this poll most unclear. If we had 
a specific list of improvements to consider, then people could vote 
which ones matter to them and maybe how much each one is worth. But 
to ask in general how much the next version is worth, not knowing 
what is likely to be in it, is too abstract to be helpful.
Rick.

From: Justin Nelson  <justinn@e...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 8:26am
Subject: Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

On the other hand, raising the "starting price" will tend to put people off 
buying and trying, while those who have bought at a low price and made good 
use of Shadow will be most likely to pay a subscription for upgrades and 
improvements

At 06:50 18/09/2002 +0000, Jeff Mitchell wrote:
>Raising the price of the base uintis is also an option,

Justin Nelson (using a Palm M515 with OS v.4.1, JackFlash, DateBk5, 
ShadowPlan and a LOAD of system extension hacks)

From: Arnold DeRoy  <aderoy@m...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 10:01am
Subject: Re: Digest Number 642

On 18 Sep 2002 06:50:01 -0000, Jeff  M. wrote:

> I am, however, tempted to be the jerk and make Shadow 3.0 require an
> update fee and thereafter have subscriptions or the like. However, I can't
> say anything since Iv'e put zero thought towards it, and it sickens me to
> think about it ;)


Jeff, 

 I would not see this as a problem. I have been using Shadow too long and will not give it up.  It would be better in my view to pay an upgrade fee over the lost of a fine developer!

-- 
Do or Do not, There is no try - Master Yoda

Arnold DeRoy, aderoy@m... on 09/18/2002

From: Malcolm Campbell  <malcolmc@s...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 10:43am
Subject: Re: That's reasonable Re: Value for Money - was HandEra support

I cant remember which one, but one Palm app offered free upgrades, but asked
people to support development by paying a voluntary upgrade fee if they
wanted to.. I think it worked quite well for them, I'd do this, certainly.
2.5 was enough of an upgrade that I'd have paid for it again.

--- Malcolm

From: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 0:15pm
Subject: Poll results for shadow-discuss

The following shadow-discuss poll is now closed.  Here are the 
final results: 


POLL QUESTION: In the date picker pop-up menu, the 
current options are: No Date, 
Yesterday, Today, Tomorrow, +1 week, 
and Choose Date. Which of the following 
options would you like added to the pop-
up list? 

CHOICES AND RESULTS
- Day after tomorrow, 32 votes, 17.11%  
- This Friday, 33 votes, 17.65%  
- Next Monday, 53 votes, 28.34%  
- Start of next month, 40 votes, 21.39%  
- The specific three days after "tomorrow"; i.e. Today's Tuesday, so options would be Thursday, Friday and Saturday in the list., 26 votes, 13.90%  
- No change to current list, 3 votes, 1.60%  



For more information about this group, please visit 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss 

For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/

From: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 0:15pm
Subject: Poll results for shadow-discuss

The following shadow-discuss poll is now closed.  Here are the 
final results: 


POLL QUESTION: If both Desktop and Handheld Shadows 
had the same functionality, which one 
do you think you would do most of your 
work on ? (i.e. creating lists, adding 
items (planning stage), reading lists, 
checking off items (implementation 
stage) 

CHOICES AND RESULTS
- Mostly working in Desktop, use HH to look up data when I'm away from PC, 20 votes, 27.40%  
- Mostly working in HH, using DT to print only, 24 votes, 32.88%  
- New lists created on HH, as they grow larger, most work will be done on DT, 19 votes, 26.03%  
- I don't know yet, 10 votes, 13.70%  



For more information about this group, please visit 
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/shadow-discuss 

For help with Yahoo! Groups, please visit
http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/groups/

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 0:24pm
Subject: Help test my potential new website

I just sent this out to the alpha group, but in the spirit of
hammering my upcoming website, I wanted to get you all to give it a good
woopin'..

	I'm imagining that I'll promote the new site come Monday give or
take, if no one objects..

	See here: http://www.codejedi.com/newsite/

		jeff

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jeff Mitchell <skeezix@s...>
Subject: [Shadow-test] Alpha test new site? :)


	Before I promote the new site over top of the current site, I
wanted to let you guys beat it up a little. If we can get everyone to give
it a whorl, it'll be another thing crossed off my important todo list so I
can get on with things :)

	If you have any problems or annoyances or observations, let me
know your OS, OS version, browser, and browser version. (For instance, I
test everything with IE 5.5, Mozilla 1.0, Konquerer (er, I forget which
version), and various others.

	I'm hoping some of you have older browsers like in the Netscape or
IE 3.x range or older :) I'll try Lynx (a text only browser for slow
connections or the visually impaired, etc).

	http://www.codejedi.com/newsite/

	Let me know what you think. I  think all the links should work
despite my trickery to avoid it killing my production site :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

_______________________________________________
Shadow-test mailing list
Shadow-test@s...
http://shadow.skeleton.org/mailman/listinfo/shadow-test

From: igglet_  <abhudgens@c...>
Date: Wed Sep 18, 2002 0:57pm
Subject: Re: "Value of SP" Poll - from its creator

I'm confused.  I think I probably missed some history, but I'm on the 
5-minute-a-day board budget for the next cou