From: jhburns8  <epelle1@a...>
Date: Sun Aug 11, 2002 3:39am
Subject: Desktop Update

Jeff,
How are the desktop enhancements coming along?
I'm sure that I'm not the only one who would appreciate an update 
from you.
Thanks for a great product.
John

From: Chris  <chris@p...>
Date: Sun Aug 11, 2002 4:03pm
Subject: Shadow DTD

I didn't see anybody reply to you on the shadow-discuss list.

You can find a DTD here:

http://www.codejedi.com/shadowplan/shadow-developer/shadow-dtd.xml

-- 
"[A] Genuinely skillful use of obscenities is uniformly absent on the 
Internet." -Karl Kleinpaste

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Aug 11, 2002 8:03pm
Subject: Re: progress and checkbox

On Sat, 10 Aug 2002, mcmug1997 wrote:

> When I was reading the manual, I got the impression that the %
> progress and the checkbox are somehow linked. Checked implies 100% 
> and 100% implies checked.
> 
> I boldly remove the checkbox from view and update the progress bar 
> instead. Since my filter hides completed items, I was surprised when 
> the item didn't disappear on 100%.
> 
> Turns out that only half of the statement above is correct. Setting 
> 100% doesn't mark the checkbox. 
> 
> Or have I missed a preference option?

	You are correct. We don't yet have the concept of "not valid" or
"not a number", so we can't set the %age to "n/a". So.. when you check, it
becomes valued at 100%. Uncheck and it returns to what it was prior to
100%. Keen.

	Set it to 100%, and the check is implied? Then.. if you uncheck,
what happens to the %age? Shoudl it go to 50, 0, or 100? Really, we want
it to go to "n/a" so that it nolonger counts. That'll come eventually.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Aug 11, 2002 8:05pm
Subject: Re: Desktop Update

On Sun, 11 Aug 2002, jhburns8 wrote:

> How are the desktop enhancements coming along? I'm sure that I'm not
> the only one who would appreciate an update from you.

	They're coming. I've had a lot of delays this summer, outside of
my control, so I'm behind.. but such is life I guess :) And being summer,
the wife has me painting the house a lot, too ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Aug 11, 2002 8:08pm
Subject: Re: Re: ShadowPlan too much of a good thing...

On Sun, 11 Aug 2002, veb8 wrote:

> Please understand that even though Bonsai's desktop is alot better 
> than Shadow's (I think you readily ackowledge that)because the palm 
> side of Shadow is so superior to the Bonsai Palm Software, I have no 
> regrets about a permanent switch from Bonai to Shadow.  So you will 
> not be receiving a "I'm leaving" kind of post:))from me.  But I 
> strongly urge you not to lose sight of the fact that once you get 
> back to the development side of things, in my opinion, this needs to 
> be your number one priority as it is not a case of "This would be 
> nice to have" but a case of fixing something that isn't working 
> properly for several people.

	Fear not; there is no loss of focus from me. Its disheartening for
me to always be saying "thats cool, but will have to wait until I do some
desktop stuff", but it has to be done, and I can always point to the group
here and say "ask them" :) Bonsai has a better desktop for sure.. but
thats all they've got, and they're moving pretty slowly so they'll lose
that race too eventually. But really, we have a different focus -- they're
good folks too, and they do good work. Just different work.. people can
use their tool or mine. I'm not insecure :) (They are insecure, mind you,
but they've got more people to pay so they worry more :P)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: mcmug1997  <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 2:32am
Subject: Re: auto refiltering

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > However if the filter criteria is about tags, and you update the 
> > tags, the items won't disappear. I need to go to filter manager 
> > to reapply the filter to make it go away.
> 
> 	You likely just need to get the screen redrawn; not the filter
> manager specifically at all.
> 
> 	It does sound like a bug, however. How are you updating the
> tags.. the tag column, Remove Tag, that sort of thing?

I add a tag using popup, ie click the tag column of the entry and 
select add tag. Although the filter requires the tag to be absent The 
entry stays there. It stays after a full screen scroll, or a resort 
(by clicking the top of the priority column).

My filter says tag-asso false or tag-asso A or tag-asso B or... That 
is, it lists a handful of tags it accepts, but also accepts entries 
without any tags.

From: DedePol  <kmurray@m...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 7:38am
Subject: Tag categories

I do feel this might be a silly question, but is there a reason why i 
can't use the tag categories in Link Manager. I can assign categories 
to tags in the Tag Manager, but when i try to sort tags by categories 
through the Link Manager, it says that this feature is not yet 
available. I haven't seen any reference to this absence in the 
documentation for 2.5, which is the version i am using.
Thanks
Kevin
__________________________________________________

Forecast for Melbourne Issued at 0505 on Monday the 12th of August 
2002
Showers developing later this morning with local hail and thunder 
during the afternoon and evening.  Fresh northwesterly wind slowly 
turning cold squally west to southwesterly this afternoon. Max 13

From: pfieldho_99  <pfieldho_99@y...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 4:16pm
Subject: Re: hot sync crash

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "mr_hank_01" <mr_hank_01@y...> wrote:
> I too have experienced a crash or lock up during hotsync with the 
> Shadow program.  The file that it stops on typically experiences a 
> data loss.  In one case, the file is unaccessible on the HH.
> 
> 
> 
> > 
> >   Also, any timeframe on the conduit bug fix?  Due to repeated 
> hanging 
> >   synx i've (reluctantly)abandoned the DT til the conduit is 
fixed. 
> >   While this is reportedly rare, it seems that those who have 
been 
> >   fortunate enough to experience it, experience it often, and 
have 
> >   suffered data loss. 
> >

You might try the solution that works for me. It is spelled out in 
message # 6673.

From: fiatspider72  <jphillips@p...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 5:43pm
Subject: Launching ActionNames Cointacts from Shadow

Jeff -

I know that you are focusing on the desktop at this point and
generally do not make changes to Shadow for integration with other
specific software, but I thought I would bring this to light for you.

I do know that Shadow plays great with AN in launching todos and
appointments and realize that you had to do some special "things" to
accomodate this.  As you are well aware, the contact launching has
never worked well when doing "goto's" with AN. :-(

While in the Iambic forums, I located a thread that was replied to by
an Iambic engineer that explains how goto's work inside of AN: 
   http://makeashorterlink.com/?G18D32F71
IIRC this was the information you said you needed if you where to
implement special goto's for AN.

Just an FYI for when serious work begins on the Shadow HH again

 - Jeramy

From: fiatspider72  <jphillips@p...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 5:46pm
Subject: Re: Launching ActionNames Contacts from Shadow

You would think that I would be able to spell "contacts"...  [:-\]

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "fiatspider72" <jphillips@p...> wrote:
> Jeff -
> 
> I know that you are focusing on the desktop at this point and
> generally do not make changes to Shadow for integration with other
> specific software, but I thought I would bring this to light for you.
> 
> I do know that Shadow plays great with AN in launching todos and
> appointments and realize that you had to do some special "things" to
> accomodate this.  As you are well aware, the contact launching has
> never worked well when doing "goto's" with AN. :-(
> 
> While in the Iambic forums, I located a thread that was replied to by
> an Iambic engineer that explains how goto's work inside of AN: 
>    http://makeashorterlink.com/?G18D32F71
> IIRC this was the information you said you needed if you where to
> implement special goto's for AN.
> 
> Just an FYI for when serious work begins on the Shadow HH again
> 
>  - Jeramy

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 8:40pm
Subject: Re: Re: auto refiltering

On Mon, 12 Aug 2002, mcmug1997 wrote:

> select add tag. Although the filter requires the tag to be absent The 
> entry stays there. It stays after a full screen scroll, or a resort 
> (by clicking the top of the priority column).
> 
> My filter says tag-asso false or tag-asso A or tag-asso B or... That 
> is, it lists a handful of tags it accepts, but also accepts entries 
> without any tags.

	Yep, okay a filter recalc issue for sure; you can use the [F]
remove/add (couple taps only) to get what you need until I fix it.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 8:41pm
Subject: Re: Tag categories

On Mon, 12 Aug 2002, DedePol wrote:

> I do feel this might be a silly question, but is there a reason why i
> can't use the tag categories in Link Manager. I can assign categories
> to tags in the Tag Manager, but when i try to sort tags by categories
> through the Link Manager, it says that this feature is not yet
> available. I haven't seen any reference to this absence in the
> documentation for 2.5, which is the version i am using.

	Tag categories are usable in the Tag Manager and in the Tag
Column, but not yet in the link manager. Just got short of time; it'll get
implemented.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 8:43pm
Subject: Re: Launching ActionNames Cointacts from Shadow

On Mon, 12 Aug 2002, fiatspider72 wrote:

> I know that you are focusing on the desktop at this point and
> generally do not make changes to Shadow for integration with other
> specific software, but I thought I would bring this to light for you.
> 
> I do know that Shadow plays great with AN in launching todos and
> appointments and realize that you had to do some special "things" to
> accomodate this.  As you are well aware, the contact launching has
> never worked well when doing "goto's" with AN. :-(
> 
> While in the Iambic forums, I located a thread that was replied to by
> an Iambic engineer that explains how goto's work inside of AN: 
>    http://makeashorterlink.com/?G18D32F71
> IIRC this was the information you said you needed if you where to
> implement special goto's for AN.

	I think it attempts this already, but I'll have to check.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: fehrmantool  <fehrmantool@y...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 10:17pm
Subject: Find & Replace in my Project Template

I use a standard outline, somewhat large, as a template file for each 
project that I start.  I duplicate that template then modify the file 
to set it up for each project.

My problem is that this standard template has many areas where I need 
to modify the "Job Number" or "Project Name", etc.  

What is a quick way to do a "find & replace" inside an outline??  I 
figure other project planners must have the same problem and there is 
probably an easy way to deal with it???

Thanks,
Eric Fehrman

From: tsuchy  <tsuchy@y...>
Date: Mon Aug 12, 2002 11:29pm
Subject: Re: Find & Replace in my Project Template

I don't think there's any way to do this in any outliner without
external apps, as far as i know..

One way to do it for a Shadow outline would be:

- Export the Template to a Memo
- Find/Replace all relevant items
- Import back into Shadow

use ReplaceDA (by Ei Mom, search for ReplaceDA on palmgear.com) to do
a bunch of replacements like that; it's freeware, but you'll need a DA
launcher (i recommend EasyLaunch, which requires a hack launcher (i
recommend X-Master, which is freeware), and is freeware), it has
"Replace All" which is very useful.

ReplaceDA won't work in any outline because of the way PalmOS deals
with inputs (they don't exist until selected), so even if Shadow had
in-place edits, you could only do one at a time anyway.

This makes a strong case for keeping templates exported in Memopad and
importing altered ones as needed.

SP would have to have a Search/Replace somehow built-in for this to
work, and it's probably not that high of a priority. Of course, no
other outliner does this (as far as i know), so this could be yet
another opportunity for Shadow Plan to blow other outliners away,
which it already does, by far.

Tom!

From: Heather Buchman  <hbuchman@h...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 4:52am
Subject: sever broken links not working

I'm using Shadow 2.5 on my Handspring Visor, and have a file with various 
links to the built in ToDo database.  I purge completed tasks from within 
ToDo regularly to keep the database size small, but leave them in my 
outline on Shadow.

I'm getting the message that some links have been severed and do I want to 
sever the broken links.  I always choose to do so when this happens, but as 
of this evening whenever I reopen this same file, it gives me the same 
message even though there have been no more deletions.  In the past the 
option to sever the broken links has worked, this time it's not.

I've tried reinstalling Shadow on the Visor, that hasn't changed 
anything.  If anyone has suggestions on what to try next, I'd appreciate 
your emailing me privately, as I don't log on to this forum.

Otherwise I'm delighted with the flexibility of ShadowPlan, in particular 
the new filters and tags - very impressive!

Many thanks -
Heather

From: mgoglio  <marco.goglio@t...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 9:57am
Subject: More Tag Preferences

I'm using Shadow 2.5 and I do an intesive use of Tag, so I have a 
feature request for handheld and Desktop:
- allow both general and List based Tag;
- adding a Icon to the Tag (So in a Spreadsheet-like View we can have 
three or four Icon-Tag showed with improvement of utilization).

In HH only:
- under the [F] menu the possibility of a quick list to choose a 
filter (I have four filter that are the most used.. and only two of 
them are applicable with a view.. )
- a speed way of adding tags to an item, like the menu of the tag 
column even this column is hidden.

Visor Platinum
OS 3.5.2.H1.5 Italian
Memory: 3951 of 7936
Shadow 2.5
A lot of HACH

Marco Goglio

From: carrdwight  <carrdwight@y...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 11:41am
Subject: Undo?

Greetings,

I am newly registered and am really getting into setting up my 
lists, etc...  But since they are all new, I am moving them around a 
lot and have bumped into some problems or challenges or …:

First, the drag and drop seems really sensitive on my M515.  I end 
up losing items all the time, and I have to look through my whole 
outline to try to find it, if I can remember the item that got moved 
at all.  Is there any way to undo the move?

Second, I am using the power of multi-pasting to move items around 
and about half the time I am too stupid to remember to clear the 
clip board before pasting and I sometimes end up with two or three 
copies of the same thing and then several combined clips and past 
the whole group two or three different places.  Again, any chance of 
an undo?  

What about a find duplicates?  I could use the find to find the 
duplicates, but again, about half the time, I don't realize I have 
duplicated the items more than once until they are in several 
places, and then I don't remember which items are where, etc...

Thanks,
Dwight...

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 2:01pm
Subject: Re: Re: Find & Replace in my Project Template

The quickest way to do this in Shadow is to use the built-in Find function.
You'll then have to go in to the details to actually change the project #.
But then you can do "find next" by using "shortcut G".

Once Jeff starts working on the desktop, hopefully one of the things he'll
add is "find and replace". Seems like the logical place for it. Hope this
helps.

Scott

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 2:05pm
Subject: Re: sever broken links not working

Heather,

To clear the broken links message you have to actually do something within
the list to cause it to be resaved. You should be able to just open any
detail record and tap "OK", and then close the list. Hope this helps.

Scott

From: smasters@a...
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 2:13pm
Subject: Re: Undo?

In the List menu there is a "revert to last" option (shortcut R) and a
"save now" option (shortcut U). If you save often, you can use the revert
to last function to "undo" recent changes. But look this up in the
reference guide to see warnings about how to use this function. Hope this
helps.

Scott

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 4:02pm
Subject: Re: sever broken links not working

On Tue, 13 Aug 2002, Heather Buchman wrote:

> I'm using Shadow 2.5 on my Handspring Visor, and have a file with various 
> links to the built in ToDo database.  I purge completed tasks from within 
> ToDo regularly to keep the database size small, but leave them in my 
> outline on Shadow.
> 
> I'm getting the message that some links have been severed and do I
> want to sever the broken links.  I always choose to do so when this
> happens, but as of this evening whenever I reopen this same file, it
> gives me the same message even though there have been no more
> deletions.  In the past the option to sever the broken links has
> worked, this time it's not.

	The seever won't "Take" until you "change" something in the file
that is concrete. So, when the big box comes up, hit Sever, but then open
details on an item and hit OK, and then close the list, and the sever
should occur.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

From: guilapbr  <guilherme.pedrosa@i...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 4:37pm
Subject: Re: ShadowPlan too much of a good thing... (zoom)

Jeff,

I'd like to make just one little comment on what you have said 
about zoom and unzoom:

> when zoomed, you can zoom in more, or unzoom. So multiple 
buttons are
> needed, and multiple grafitti strokes, and it would lead to 
confusion :/
> Its also only 2 taps to any of these options, in the top right 
popmenus.

When you want to go up just a level, you must select "view" (1 
tap), "unzoom" (1 more tap), select the parent level you were (1 
or more taps - sometimes it closes all the tree), select "view" 
(1 more tap), "zoom to level" (1 more tap). So, this takes at 
least 5 taps (or is there a faster way? let me know that), while 
there's a specific button to do this in Progect, for example.

I know you're busy in the desktop (I agree it's the most urgent), 
but do you think that a request to new Shadow (Palm) versions 
could be put an "Up a Level" item in "View" menu?

Thanks for your attention,
Guilherme.

From: bblackmoor  <bblackmoor@b...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 5:45pm
Subject: Re: Drifting structure - Loss of enumeration

"pfieldho_99" <pfieldho_99@y...> wrote:
> 
> I too have experienced this restructuring of a list that 
> several have spoken of recently... Items that were siblings 
> suddenly and unexplicably become children of their previous 
> peers.

I'm seeing this, too. (I'm new to this list, so forgive me if this bug
has been discussed to death.)

Also, there are duplicate items being created. What begins as:

Entertainment
\-Movies
   |-Star Wars
   |  |-Harrison Ford
   |  |-Mark Hamill
   |  \-Carrie Fisher
   \-Indiana Jones
      \-Harrison Ford

Becomes like this:

Entertainment
|-Movies
|-Movies
\-Movies
   |-Star Wars
   |-Star Wars
   |-Star Wars
   |-Star Wars
   |  |-Harrison Ford
   |  |-Mark Hamill
   |  \-Carrie Fisher
   |-Indiana Jones
   \-Indiana Jones
      \-Harrison Ford

Is that clear? You may have to use a monospaced font to make sense of it.

This is really getting tiresome. At least Shadow isn't crashing my
Palm like Progect did, but it'd be nice of the data would stay where I
put it.

I don't even use the "linking" functions of Shadow -- I wouldn't dare.
I'd have to see it do just basic outlining reliably before I'd be
willing to experiment with more complex functions.

bblackmoor@b...
2002-08-13

From: Anthony Schellenberg  <aschell2000@h...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 5:48pm
Subject: Re: sever broken links not working

I think this dialog should say something like 'sever broken links at next 
save?'  This would make it a lot clearer.


>From: smasters@a...
>Reply-To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
>To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] sever broken links not working
>Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:05:41 -0500
>
>
>Heather,
>
>To clear the broken links message you have to actually do something within
>the list to cause it to be resaved. You should be able to just open any
>detail record and tap "OK", and then close the list. Hope this helps.
>
>Scott
>
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/




_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com

From: bblackmoor  <bblackmoor@b...>
Date: Tue Aug 13, 2002 6:03pm
Subject: Re: Drifting structure - Loss of enumeration

"bblackmoor" <bblackmoor@b...> wrote:
> 
> Also, there are duplicate items being created. What begins as:

Actually, this was an oversimplification. What I often see is this:

From:

 Entertainment
 |-1. Books
 |  |-A. Herbert, Frank
 |  |  |-a. Dune
 |  |  |-b. Dosadi Experiment
 |  |  \-c. Hellstrom's Hive
 |  \-B. Norfolk, Lawrence
 |     \-a. Lempriere's Dictinary
 \-2. Movies
    |-A. Star Wars
    |  |-a. Harrison Ford
    |  |-b. Mark Hamill
    |  \-c. Carrie Fisher
    \-B. Indiana Jones
       \-a. Harrison Ford
 
To:

 Entertainment
 |-1. Books
 |  |-A. Herbert, Frank
 |  |  |-2. Movies
 |  |  |   |- Star Wars
 |  |  |   |- Star Wars
 |  |  |   |-1. Star Wars
 |  |  |   |  |-a. Harrison Ford
 |  |  |   |  |-b. Mark Hamill
 |  |  |   |  \-c. Carrie Fisher
 |  |  |   \-B. Indiana Jones
 |  |  |       \-a. Harrison Ford
 |  |  |-a. Dune
 |  |  |-b. Dosadi Experiment
 |  |  \-c. Hellstrom's Hive
 |  |- Movies
 |  |   |-A. Star Wars
 |  |   |  |-a. Harrison Ford
 |  |   |  |-b. Mark Hamill
 |  |   |  \-c. Carrie Fisher
 |  |   \-B. Indiana Jones
 |  |      \-a. Harrison Ford
 |  |- Norfolk, Lawrence
 |  |-B. Norfolk, Lawrence
 |  |-C. Norfolk, Lawrence
 |  |- Norfolk, Lawrence
 |     \-a. Lempriere's Dictinary
 |-2. Movies
 |- Movies
 \-3. Movies
    |-A. Star Wars
    |- Star Wars
    |-B. Star Wars
    |  |-a. Harrison Ford
    |  |-b. Mark Hamill
    |  \-c. Carrie Fisher
    \-C. Indiana Jones
       \-a. Harrison Ford


You get the idea. I spend ten minutes every time I open a Shadow file
trying to figure out what it's supposed to look like, re-arranging the
misplaced items and deleting all the duplicates.

bblackmoor@b...
2002-08-13

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 3:25am
Subject: Critical Path Analysis

Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to 
Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is the 
linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See 
http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not 
on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?

_________________________________________________
Bob Pankratz  •  bob@r...

Linux is only free if your time is worthless


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: llgriffll  <keith@t...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 3:55am
Subject: Re: sever broken links not working

Really Shadow should see those items that had links severed as 
changed...and save those at next close...

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Anthony Schellenberg" 
<aschell2000@h...> wrote:
> I think this dialog should say something like 'sever broken links 
at next 
> save?'  This would make it a lot clearer.
> 
> 
> >From: smasters@a...
> >Reply-To: shadow-discuss@y...
> >To: shadow-discuss@y...
> >Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] sever broken links not working
> >Date: Tue, 13 Aug 2002 09:05:41 -0500
> >
> >
> >Heather,
> >
> >To clear the broken links message you have to actually do 
something within
> >the list to cause it to be resaved. You should be able to just 
open any
> >detail record and tap "OK", and then close the list. Hope this 
helps.
> >
> >Scott
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> >shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@e...
> >
> >
> >
> >Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _________________________________________________________________
> Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: 
http://mobile.msn.com

From: mcmug1997  <Alex.Fung.Ho-san+yahoo@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 4:55am
Subject: Re: More Tag Preferences

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "mgoglio" <marco.goglio@t...> wrote:
> - under the [F] menu the possibility of a quick list to choose a 
> filter (I have four filter that are the most used.. and only two of 
> them are applicable with a view.. )

Yes a great idea!

> - a speed way of adding tags to an item, like the menu of the tag 
> column even this column is hidden.

I would like to see a tag menu like the C/F/V menu, with a quick list 
like you suggested for F.

Even though I view the tag column, it is a bit tedious to add tags: 
Tab column, tab add, tab catagory, then select the tag.

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 7:16am
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

explain c.p.a....

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Pankratz 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 7:25 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis


  Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to 
  Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is the 
  linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See 
  http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not 
  on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?

  _________________________________________________
  Bob Pankratz  .  bob@r...

  Linux is only free if your time is worthless


  [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com

   

  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Jacob Share  <jacob@s...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:08am
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

I too would love to see this functionality in Shadow but in the meantime
have you tried Hours?

http://hours.sourceforge.net/

Jacob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:25 AM
Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis


> Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
> Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is the
> linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
> http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
> on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
>
> _________________________________________________
> Bob Pankratz  •  bob@r...
>
> Linux is only free if your time is worthless
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>

From: Corey Colyer  <cjcolyer@i...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:52am
Subject: filtered export

Greetings group,

If this is covered someplace in the manual please feel free to gently point me in the direction.

Can I export a filtered list?  

I use shadow for my project planning and tracking.  Since I'm the only handheld user in my group at work, I've taken to exporting my project lists to DOC, using shadow's cool html function, and posting them in a shared directory.  Right now I export the whole list and then edit the html to eliminate things that were done in a prior period.  What I'd like to do is invoke a filter or view and export that content into memo.

It doesn't look like shadow can do this currently, and I presume it would take a lot of code to generate this kind of feature.  [I suppose the desktop is an option, but our IT folks get cranky about us installing "unsupported" software on our work machines...so I've avoided getting it]. Then again, perhaps this is already implemented and I've just missed.  No harm in asking.

Thanks in advance,

/Corey

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 0:53pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

Not quite what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a the ability to pre 
plan the work day base on appointment commitments. By about 8am each day 
my calendar is about set. Based On that I'm looking to have my Todos 
flow into the gaps in the schedule; giving me recommendations for the 
best things to work on when based on time available and priority.

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 04:08 AM, Jacob Share wrote:

> I too would love to see this functionality in Shadow but in the meantime
> have you tried Hours?
>
> http://hours.sourceforge.net/
>
> Jacob
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
> To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:25 AM
> Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>
>
>> Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
>> Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is the
>> linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
>> http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
>> on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
>>
>> _________________________________________________
>> Bob Pankratz  •  bob@r...
>>
>> Linux is only free if your time is worthless
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 1:04pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

1) For any to-do item be able to indicate the minimum amount of
time required (MATR) to work on the to-do.

2) Add a new view type, or an optional mode of the day view that:

a) Notices the time gap between appointments
b) Searches for to-do's that have MATR's that fit the gaps
c) Fills each gap with the to-do that fits, and is highest in priority 
order.

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 02:16 AM, Kevin Giberson wrote:

> explain c.p.a....
>
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: Bob Pankratz
>   To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
>   Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 7:25 PM
>   Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>
>
>   Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
>   Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is 
> the
>   linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
>   http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
>   on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
>
>   _________________________________________________
>   Bob Pankratz  .  bob@r...
>
>   Linux is only free if your time is worthless
>
>
>   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>   To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>   shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
>   Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche

From: sgarelick  <steve@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 1:42pm
Subject: Tracking project start/end dates

Is there any way to get Shadow to show the start date of an item 
along with the target date on the list screen? I would like to be 
able to enter in all the tasks for my projects and be able to quicky 
ascertain when each task will begin/end without having to bring up 
the details screen.

From: Jacob Share  <jacob@s...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 4:47pm
Subject: Creation date bug?

I just realized that the Creation Date (cr) noted in an item doesn't change with a copy & paste. Is that the way it should be?

To be clearer - in some of my lists I have a templatized branch that I copy, paste and adjust accordingly. I just realized that all the items I have pasted have the cr of the original templatized branch. I'd rather the cr be the date that I pasted, in effect, the Creation Date of the adjusted item. Is this a bug? Also, the cr of these items is 1/1/04. What's up with that?

Jacob


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Earthlink  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 5:12pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items moved for them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be taken care of before MATR is even discussed as a reality...like conduit, desktop, and many of the other additions to the handheld mentioned in the past.  sounds like something that might slow down and/or bloat the system too, which i would not desire.  if you've been reading the posts for months, it will be a while before any of the handheld suggestions are worked on again, as Jeff has the other items on his list to accomplish first.  funny the people getting the program recently come in with all these new ideas having no idea how much discussion and work has taken place thus far, as well as Jeff many times already telling us he will now be on the conduit, desktop, and various formats for months!  the program can't be everything to everyone.  my thoughts this morning without my mocha beside me!
kevin


------------------------------
Enjoy life!
------------------------------
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Pankratz 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 6:04 AM
  Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis


  1) For any to-do item be able to indicate the minimum amount of
  time required (MATR) to work on the to-do.

  2) Add a new view type, or an optional mode of the day view that:

  a) Notices the time gap between appointments
  b) Searches for to-do's that have MATR's that fit the gaps
  c) Fills each gap with the to-do that fits, and is highest in priority 
  order.

  On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 02:16 AM, Kevin Giberson wrote:

  > explain c.p.a....
  >
  >   ----- Original Message -----
  >   From: Bob Pankratz
  >   To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
  >   Sent: Tuesday, August 13, 2002 7:25 PM
  >   Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
  >
  >
  >   Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
  >   Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is 
  > the
  >   linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
  >   http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
  >   on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
  >
  >   _________________________________________________
  >   Bob Pankratz  .  bob@r...
  >
  >   Linux is only free if your time is worthless
  >
  >
  >   [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
  >
  >
  >
  >   To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  >   shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
  >
  >
  >
  >   Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
  >
  >
  >
  > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  > shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
  >
  >
  >
  > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
  > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
  >
  >
  Bob Pankratz
  Director of Technology Services
  Plexus Corp.
  www.plexus.com
  bob.pankratz@p...

  "He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
  -- Nietzsche


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
              ADVERTISEMENT
             
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Earthlink  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 5:14pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

funny, sounds like a Life Balance type of thing, which i personally hated.
don't like it doing my thinking for me!
kevin


------------------------------
Enjoy life!
------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:53 AM
Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis


Not quite what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a the ability to pre
plan the work day base on appointment commitments. By about 8am each day
my calendar is about set. Based On that I'm looking to have my Todos
flow into the gaps in the schedule; giving me recommendations for the
best things to work on when based on time available and priority.

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 04:08 AM, Jacob Share wrote:

> I too would love to see this functionality in Shadow but in the meantime
> have you tried Hours?
>
> http://hours.sourceforge.net/
>
> Jacob
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
> To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:25 AM
> Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>
>
>> Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
>> Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is the
>> linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
>> http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
>> on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
>>
>> _________________________________________________
>> Bob Pankratz  •  bob@r...
>>
>> Linux is only free if your time is worthless
>>
>>
>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>
>>
>>
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

From: jledesma28  <jledesma28@y...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 8:50pm
Subject: Jeff: Is tracking by time coming up ?, let me explain via a GTD post I found

It would be neat to able to have an option on the link manager where 
one could pick the duration of time, for example, picking 30min.,45 
min., 1hr ,etc. etc. or even # of days and minutes. I stumbled on to 
a great article on the David Allen site that I want to share with all 
of you and gather some feedback it deals with prioritizing and time 
factoring.

Posted by: Chris Murtland 	Posted 08-12-2002 02:05	
Re: Deadlines 
 
I struggled with the time element too, at first. It is 
oversimplifying to say that the only actions with a time element go 
on the hard landscape, or calendar. There are plenty of actions that 
don't necessarily have a hard edge (they don't need to be done on one 
particular day) but that do need to be done BY a specific date, or 
have an increased value if they are done by a specific date. 

The illumination for me was that David doesn't suggest stopping at 
context for organizing next actions: that's just the first (and most 
important) layer of grouping. Beyond that, you can use other 
criteria: time required, priority, etc. 

What I have found useful is expanding the criteria I enter for each 
next action [note: the ease of doing this will depend somewhat on 
your technology solution for implementing GTD]. If something is a 
next action, but I'm not going to start on it until next week, I put 
a start date on it and filter out future items from my lists. I also 
enter an estimated duration for each action, so that I can quickly 
narrow down by time available on any list (if I only have 45 minutes, 
I view all items with estimated durations of 45 minutes or less). 

I also enter an amount field for every action, which is my way of 
prioritizing. This is basically the amount of money that is at stake 
if the action isn't completed - which makes more valuable items rise 
to the top (this value determined by a small business perspective - 
your value rating may be entirely different and doesn't have to be 
money). 

Finally, I don't hesitate to add a "date due" to any action. To me, 
this is different than a hard landscape date. In any case, I have 
items with the closest due date at the top of my list, then sorted by 
amount. 

I've found this approach helps me keep the time element and relative 
importance of an action in front of me. I also scan the entire 
actions list at least a couple of times a day, because often I'll 
just be in the mood to complete an item lower on the list. This may 
be a deviation from pure GTD, but I just see it as putting enough 
clues on the list to aid in my intuitive decision of which action to 
take. It does require a pretty robust technology implementation 
(Hint: Zoot + Outlook) because you have to be able to quickly and 
easily manage the additional criteria.


thanks for the feeback,

jledesma

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:19pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

Actually it's very much not LifeBalance;

it's very much Project Management, due date and resource availability 
based.

see: www.1soft.com and www.taskline.info

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 12:14 PM, Earthlink wrote:

> funny, sounds like a Life Balance type of thing, which i personally 
> hated.
> don't like it doing my thinking for me!
> kevin
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Enjoy life!
> ------------------------------
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
> To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:53 AM
> Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>
>
> Not quite what I'm looking for. I'm looking for a the ability to pre
> plan the work day base on appointment commitments. By about 8am each day
> my calendar is about set. Based On that I'm looking to have my Todos
> flow into the gaps in the schedule; giving me recommendations for the
> best things to work on when based on time available and priority.
>
> On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 04:08 AM, Jacob Share wrote:
>
>> I too would love to see this functionality in Shadow but in the 
>> meantime
>> have you tried Hours?
>>
>> http://hours.sourceforge.net/
>>
>> Jacob
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Bob Pankratz" <bob@r...>
>> To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 5:25 AM
>> Subject: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>>
>>
>>> Has there been any past discussion of adding Critical Path Analysis to
>>> Shadow? Most of the information in already in Shadow database as is 
>>> the
>>> linking. The only thing missing is display of the information.  See
>>> http://www.taskline.info which does exactly what I'm thinking, but not
>>> on the Palm. Any one else think this might be a desirable feature set?
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________
>>> Bob Pankratz  •  bob@r...
>>>
>>> Linux is only free if your time is worthless
>>>
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>>> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>>
>>
>>
>> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
>> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>>
>>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>

From: rvanderwoning  <rvanderwoning@y...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:20pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Earthlink" <kevin@g...> wrote:
> can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items 
moved for them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be 
taken care of before MATR is even discussed as a reality...

You'd have to throw in a poll if you want to get any reliable 
indication of how many people would want this. Your personal 
preference is no indication of that.

> funny the people getting the program recently come in with all 
these new ideas having no idea how much discussion and work has 
taken place thus far, as well as Jeff many times already telling us 
he will now be on the conduit, desktop, and various formats for 
months!  the program can't be everything to everyone.

Why is that funny? All the man did was ask if there had been any 
past discussion on this topic and if other people might find this a 
desirable option. He didn't request for it to be put in immediately 
so why the rehashing of Jeff's priority list?

I for one would find a feature like this very useful. Perhaps I'll 
wake up one day and find it in my newly downloaded Shadow version. :)

Roy.

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 9:23pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

Wow since that assumes evidence not in facts about me; or assumes I'm 
plan stupid; I'll suggest you have that coffee first before posting that 
I have "no idea"......

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 12:12 PM, Earthlink wrote:

> can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items moved for 
> them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be taken care of 
> before MATR is even discussed as a reality...like conduit, desktop, and 
> many of the other additions to the handheld mentioned in the past.
> sounds like something that might slow down and/or bloat the system too, 
> which i would not desire.  if you've been reading the posts for months, 
> it will be a while before any of the handheld suggestions are worked on 
> again, as Jeff has the other items on his list to accomplish first.
>  funny the people getting the program recently come in with all these 
> new ideas having no idea how much discussion and work has taken place 
> thus far, as well as Jeff many times already telling us he will now be 
> on the conduit, desktop, and various formats for months!  the program 
> can't be everything to everyone.  my thoughts this morning without my 
> mocha beside me!
> kevin
>

From: Earthlink  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 10:30pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

didn't mean for you to take it all those ways you mention Bob...but clearly this idea is many months away from even being considered as a possibility if you've been reading all the months of posts.  even having all this discussion now on such a new and large addition to the handheld seems like a waste of time.  not being personal, but just realistic in that i wouldn't expect anything like this to be considered until into 2003.  remember, Jeff does not have a staff like other developers that put out much less in the same period of time.  and i've had my coffee this time!  ; )
kevin
p.s.  it's "facts not in evidence"!  ; )


------------------------------
Enjoy life!
------------------------------
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Bob Pankratz 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 2:23 PM
  Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis


  Wow since that assumes evidence not in facts about me; or assumes I'm 
  plan stupid; I'll suggest you have that coffee first before posting that 
  I have "no idea"......

  On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 12:12 PM, Earthlink wrote:

  > can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items moved for 
  > them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be taken care of 
  > before MATR is even discussed as a reality...like conduit, desktop, and 
  > many of the other additions to the handheld mentioned in the past.
  > sounds like something that might slow down and/or bloat the system too, 
  > which i would not desire.  if you've been reading the posts for months, 
  > it will be a while before any of the handheld suggestions are worked on 
  > again, as Jeff has the other items on his list to accomplish first.
  >  funny the people getting the program recently come in with all these 
  > new ideas having no idea how much discussion and work has taken place 
  > thus far, as well as Jeff many times already telling us he will now be 
  > on the conduit, desktop, and various formats for months!  the program 
  > can't be everything to everyone.  my thoughts this morning without my 
  > mocha beside me!
  > kevin
  >




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Earthlink  <kevin@g...>
Date: Wed Aug 14, 2002 10:54pm
Subject: Re: Re: Critical Path Analysis

as i'm reading my inbox in reverse order...i'd agree with "our" personal preferences not being a reliable indication alone, but usually if an idea is really wanted by many we hear all sorts of responses on this list requesting the addition.  i'm sure there are some that would love this idea, as well as some for about every idea you could come up with.  my comments were not intended to be personal, but to have you ask yourself realistically how many people would you benefit versus the bloat to all users.  the idea you mention takes off on a tangent from the simple concept of what Jeff has created.  simple and less bloated would seem to work best for the majority, as we've already heard complaints of it being complicated with tags and filters for some.  i'm just throwing out thoughts about overall marketability and large scale use with the idea of bloat if every idea suggested is tossed into the program.  i'm a fan of keeping the program where the options can be useful to all or most, not getting too specialized with things that bloat the program and will not be used by most.  no more from me on this topic...looking forward to the upcoming desktop and conduit releases from Jeff!  and as always Jeff, thanks.
kevin


------------------------------
Enjoy life!
------------------------------
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: rvanderwoning 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 2:20 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Re: Critical Path Analysis


  --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Earthlink" <kevin@g...> wrote:
  > can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items 
  moved for them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be 
  taken care of before MATR is even discussed as a reality...

  You'd have to throw in a poll if you want to get any reliable 
  indication of how many people would want this. Your personal 
  preference is no indication of that.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 0:32am
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

LOL - now that was a transpose - Good catch. You do seem to be much more 
caffeine stable now. :)
With that clarifcation, my reason for posting was to see what other 
might think for the usefulness. Shadow is remarkably prepare to do CPA 
because of all the other data it has. This opens a number of posibilites:
1) add it to shadow
2) use the open shadow standards to develop it
3) integrate it with a third part and app and like via the datebook.

So far (1) would be a long wait, to much else to do. (2) Could be done 
thanks to Jeff's open approach, but is there enough interest. (3) 
Someone already pointed me at www.taskline.info which works with 
outlook. I'm going to test that with shadow's link and see how it works.

I'm in the process of porting a complicate GTD method to the shadow 
platform; and CPA is the one area I haven't been able to solve on other 
palm tools; I think Shadow may just shine in that area.

PS: sorry I poked to hard at your first response; you wrote before 
coffee; I responded too close to the end of a LONG day.

On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 05:30 PM, Earthlink wrote:

> didn't mean for you to take it all those ways you mention Bob...but 
> clearly this idea is many months away from even being considered as a 
> possibility if you've been reading all the months of posts.  even 
> having all this discussion now on such a new and large addition to the 
> handheld seems like a waste of time.  not being personal, but just 
> realistic in that i wouldn't expect anything like this to be considered 
> until into 2003.  remember, Jeff does not have a staff like other 
> developers that put out much less in the same period of time.  and i've 
> had my coffee this time!  ; )
> kevin
> p.s.  it's "facts not in evidence"!  ; )
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Enjoy life!
> ------------------------------
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: Bob Pankratz
>   To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
>   Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 2:23 PM
>   Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Critical Path Analysis
>
>
>   Wow since that assumes evidence not in facts about me; or assumes I'm
>   plan stupid; I'll suggest you have that coffee first before posting 
> that
>   I have "no idea"......
>
>   On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 12:12 PM, Earthlink wrote:
>
>> can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items moved for
>> them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be taken care of
>> before MATR is even discussed as a reality...like conduit, desktop, and
>> many of the other additions to the handheld mentioned in the past.
>> sounds like something that might slow down and/or bloat the system too,
>> which i would not desire.  if you've been reading the posts for months,
>> it will be a while before any of the handheld suggestions are worked on
>> again, as Jeff has the other items on his list to accomplish first.
>>  funny the people getting the program recently come in with all these
>> new ideas having no idea how much discussion and work has taken place
>> thus far, as well as Jeff many times already telling us he will now be
>> on the conduit, desktop, and various formats for months!  the program
>> can't be everything to everyone.  my thoughts this morning without my
>> mocha beside me!
>> kevin
>>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 0:38am
Subject: Re: Re: Critical Path Analysis

Just to note that wasn't me that responded....

But to this thought thread, I think the reason it's good to talk about 
these ideas now is for the very fact that the interface has drifted. 
Jeff honestly acknowledges that the GUI has to be revisited and cleaned 
up eventually. The time to think about this that and the other thing is 
before re-tooling; that we you don't re-tool and then start hacking and 
messing it all up again. Instead you plan ahead and even if you don't 
implement you leave accommodation for the future.

I liken it to the 1 year polite argument with CESD over DB4/5 
preferences.  I don't think I ever missed a chance to point out 
everytime he said, "I can't because the preferences design doesn't have 
room" finally I think when he'd snuffed 20 easy feature because of that 
statement he relented and modified it. The busy programmer doesn't 
always have time to have all the ideas and track all the facts. That's 
more suited for us annoying users. :) :)



On Wednesday, August 14, 2002, at 05:54 PM, Earthlink wrote:

> as i'm reading my inbox in reverse order...i'd agree with "our" 
> personal preferences not being a reliable indication alone, but usually 
> if an idea is really wanted by many we hear all sorts of responses on 
> this list requesting the addition.  i'm sure there are some that would 
> love this idea, as well as some for about every idea you could come up 
> with.  my comments were not intended to be personal, but to have you 
> ask yourself realistically how many people would you benefit versus the 
> bloat to all users.  the idea you mention takes off on a tangent from 
> the simple concept of what Jeff has created.  simple and less bloated 
> would seem to work best for the majority, as we've already heard 
> complaints of it being complicated with tags and filters for some.  i'm 
> just throwing out thoughts about overall marketability and large scale 
> use with the idea of bloat if every idea suggested is tossed into the 
> program.  i'm a fan of keeping the program where the options can be 
> useful to all or most, not getting too specialized with things that 
> bloat the program and will not be used by most.  no more from me on 
> this topic...looking forward to the upcoming desktop and conduit 
> releases from Jeff!  and as always Jeff, thanks.
> kevin
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Enjoy life!
> ------------------------------
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: rvanderwoning
>   To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
>   Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 2:20 PM
>   Subject: [shadow-discuss] Re: Critical Path Analysis
>
>
>   --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Earthlink" <kevin@g...> wrote:
>> can't imagine many people using this concept or wanting items
>   moved for them in this manner, as i'd prefer many other items to be
>   taken care of before MATR is even discussed as a reality...
>
>   You'd have to throw in a poll if you want to get any reliable
>   indication of how many people would want this. Your personal
>   preference is no indication of that.
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 5:08am
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Bob Pankratz <bob@r...> wrote:
> Just to note that wasn't me that responded....
> 
> But to this thought thread, I think the reason it's good to talk
about 
> these ideas now is for the very fact that the interface has
drifted. 
> Jeff honestly acknowledges that the GUI has to be revisited and
cleaned 
> up eventually. The time to think about this that and the other
thing is 
> before re-tooling; that we you don't re-tool and then start hacking
and 
> messing it all up again. Instead you plan ahead and even if you
don't 
> implement you leave accommodation for the future.
> 
<snip>

Don't mean to back into this one guys, but I would think this is not
only timely but a good idea for a feature...

... but for the *desktop*.

On the practical side (and not pretending to speak for Jeff), I belive
the intent is to put the light management and data entry facilties
into the HH but leave the large sweeping activities (like this one and
other cross-item and cross-list analyses) into the desktop.

I believe this was born out by the poll that showed most people did
most substantial data entry on the desktop.  So a sort of "big action,
big machine ... small action, small machine" philosophy.

After all, do you want to carry around code that would most likely
only be used a max. of once a day.  Most likely I'd do that kind of
fill once a week, only repeating for that week if something seriously
intruded on the schedule (but that's just me).

Just my 2 cents...

Ken

From: bblackmoor  <bblackmoor@b...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 6:40am
Subject: Re: Drifting structure - Loss of enumeration

So what's the deal with the randomly-rearranging, spontaneously
duplicating outline items? Is there a fix? A workaround? Something?

I paid for Shadow Plan a while back, but I've only started using it
heavily recently. I would like to become dependent on it -- when it
works, it's a great help. But this bug is just too much to deal with.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

bblackmoor@b...
2002-08-14

From: Kevin Giberson  <kevin@g...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 7:49am
Subject: Re: Re: Critical Path Analysis

well said...

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: kenclatham 
  To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 14, 2002 9:08 PM
  Subject: [shadow-discuss] Re: Critical Path Analysis


  --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Bob Pankratz <bob@r...> wrote:
  > Just to note that wasn't me that responded....
  > 
  > But to this thought thread, I think the reason it's good to talk
  about 
  > these ideas now is for the very fact that the interface has
  drifted. 
  > Jeff honestly acknowledges that the GUI has to be revisited and
  cleaned 
  > up eventually. The time to think about this that and the other
  thing is 
  > before re-tooling; that we you don't re-tool and then start hacking
  and 
  > messing it all up again. Instead you plan ahead and even if you
  don't 
  > implement you leave accommodation for the future.
  > 
  <snip>

  Don't mean to back into this one guys, but I would think this is not
  only timely but a good idea for a feature...

  ... but for the *desktop*.

  On the practical side (and not pretending to speak for Jeff), I belive
  the intent is to put the light management and data entry facilties
  into the HH but leave the large sweeping activities (like this one and
  other cross-item and cross-list analyses) into the desktop.

  I believe this was born out by the poll that showed most people did
  most substantial data entry on the desktop.  So a sort of "big action,
  big machine ... small action, small machine" philosophy.

  After all, do you want to carry around code that would most likely
  only be used a max. of once a day.  Most likely I'd do that kind of
  fill once a week, only repeating for that week if something seriously
  intruded on the schedule (but that's just me).

  Just my 2 cents...

  Ken


        Yahoo! Groups Sponsor 
              ADVERTISEMENT
             
       

  To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com



  Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. 



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

From: wvit  <wvit@y...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 8:50am
Subject: Col-bg problem

Hi, in the preference there is an option Col-bg. If set the row will have a 
background color. My problem is I don't like the current color (light 
blue). Can I change it, please?

From: neilbothams  <neil.bothams@b...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 11:48am
Subject: Datebk5 advance; Lifebalance leadtime and Shadow dates

Hi

Am I missing something?  Each program seems to have its own way of 
handling deadlines and other dates on todos.

Datebk5 - each todo has a date and you can set an advance date.  Also 
tracks overdue by x days.

Lifebalance - can set a leadtime. A task appears before its deadline 
if a leadtime has been set. Also overdue flag.

Can these be exchanged in any way with Shadow dates?  As far as I can 
see only the target date is exchanged.

From: Bob Pankratz  <bob@r...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 0:20pm
Subject: Re: Datebk5 advance; Lifebalance leadtime and Shadow dates

Lifebalance is also being modified to honor the Advances in Datebk5 
correctly. So "advances" would be the the ones to target/integrate with 
shadow's "start date"

On Thursday, August 15, 2002, at 06:48 AM, neilbothams wrote:

> Hi
>
> Am I missing something?  Each program seems to have its own way of
> handling deadlines and other dates on todos.
>
> Datebk5 - each todo has a date and you can set an advance date.  Also
> tracks overdue by x days.
>
> Lifebalance - can set a leadtime. A task appears before its deadline
> if a leadtime has been set. Also overdue flag.
>
> Can these be exchanged in any way with Shadow dates?  As far as I can
> see only the target date is exchanged.
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
Bob Pankratz
Director of Technology Services
Plexus Corp.
www.plexus.com
bob.pankratz@p...

"He who fights too long against dragons becomes a dragon himself."
-- Nietzsche

From: grn_white  <michael.walter@r...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 2:09pm
Subject: Re: Critical Path Analysis

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Bob Pankratz <bob@r...> wrote:
> > Just to note that wasn't me that responded....
> > 
> > But to this thought thread, I think the reason it's good to talk
> about 
> > these ideas now is for the very fact that the interface has
> drifted. 
> > Jeff honestly acknowledges that the GUI has to be revisited and
> cleaned 
> > up eventually. The time to think about this that and the other
> thing is 
> > before re-tooling; that we you don't re-tool and then start 
hacking
> and 
> > messing it all up again. Instead you plan ahead and even if you
> don't 
> > implement you leave accommodation for the future.
> > 
> <snip>
> 
> Don't mean to back into this one guys, but I would think this is not
> only timely but a good idea for a feature...
> 
> ... but for the *desktop*.
> 
> On the practical side (and not pretending to speak for Jeff), I 
belive
> the intent is to put the light management and data entry facilties
> into the HH but leave the large sweeping activities (like this one 
and
> other cross-item and cross-list analyses) into the desktop.
> 
> I believe this was born out by the poll that showed most people did
> most substantial data entry on the desktop.  So a sort of "big 
action,
> big machine ... small action, small machine" philosophy.
> 
> After all, do you want to carry around code that would most likely
> only be used a max. of once a day.  Most likely I'd do that kind of
> fill once a week, only repeating for that week if something 
seriously
> intruded on the schedule (but that's just me).
> 
> Just my 2 cents...
> 
> Ken


I have not followed this thread closely, BUT this thread and other 
posts screaming for Desktop upgrades bug me,  WHY did you but a palm 
if you do your data entry, etc. on a desktop/laptop????  Why bother 
with a palm at all if it is only a fancy gadget to carry around? Paper 
works just as good for carrying around info created on a desktop.  

I may be in the minority (although I doubt it) but I use the HH 
exclusively to do my input etc. I use it all day, not once a day.  The 
HH side work Jeff has done has been great at adding features, although 
I agree that the UI is becoming too cluttered and the program is 
becoming complicated to use.  The manual (and the website) need 
serious updating to eliminate old stuff no longer relevant and make it 
easier to understand (maybe Jeff needs someone else to do his amnual 
for him as programmers are not always the best people to communicate 
in simple, well organized terms.)

I would strongly vote against making Shadow a 'desktop driven' piece 
of software where I need a desktop to get full usage out of it.  The 
HH should not be a 'light' version of a desktop program, It should be 
THE program with the DT useful for data entry, export to other 
programs etc.  Jeff - keep the HH focus, do not let this become DT 
behemoth!

My 2 cents - (OK maybe 2 1/2)

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Thu Aug 15, 2002 2:20pm
Subject: RE: Re: Critical Path Analysis

I understand where you're coming from, and this is an interesting
debate. You asked why someone would bother with a Palm if they do data
entry on the desktop, and there are several reasons. Nice big keyboard
and screen come to mind immediately-- it's simply easier and faster to
type things in than to Graffiti them into your Palm. I use my Palm all
day and half the night, but I use it more as an information retrieval
device than as a data entry device (except when I'm taking notes in my
grad school classes).

As far as Shadow is concerned, of course I do most of my work on the
handheld, but I think that will change once the desktop comes up to
speed. For large lists, nothing beats the ease of a keyboard. And I'm
very interested in the idea of having CPA on the desktop, as well as any
other idea that might cause bloat in the handheld version. Jeff is
remarkably democratic in his development, and might take our suggestions
into account for things that might fit better on the desktop component,
or on the handheld, or both.

But I certainly don't think that just because I use my laptop for large
amounts of data entry means that my Palm is useless! It just means that
I can take ALL of my information everywhere I go.

Jen

-------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!


-----Original Message-----
From: grn_white [mailto:michael.walter@r...] 
Sent: Thursday, August 15, 2002 9:09 AM
To: shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [shadow-discuss] Re: Critical Path Analysis

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Bob Pankratz <bob@r...> wrote:
> > Just to note that wasn't me that responded....
> > 
> > But to this thought thread, I think the reason it's good to talk
> about 
> > these ideas now is for the very fact that the interface has
> drifted. 
> > Jeff honestly acknowledges that the GUI has to be revisited and
> cleaned 
> > up eventually. The time to think about this that and the other
> thing is 
> > before re-tooling; that we you don't re-tool and then start 
hacking
> and 
> > messing it all up again. Instead you plan ahead and even if you
> don't 
> > implement you leave accommodation for the future.
> > 
> <snip>
> 
> Don't mean to back into this one guys, but I would think this is not
> only timely but a good idea for a feature...
> 
> ... but for the *desktop*.
> 
> On the practical side (and not pretending to speak for Jeff), I 
belive
> the intent is to put the light management and data entry facilties
> into the HH but leave the large sweeping activities (like this one 
and
> other cross-item and cross-list analyses) into the desktop.
> 
> I believe this was born out by the poll that showed most people did
> most substantial data entry on the desktop.  So a sort of "big 
action,
> big machine ... small action, small machine" philosophy.
> 
> After all, do you want to carry around code that would most likely
> only be used a max. of once a day.  Most likely I'd do that kind of
> fill once a week, only repeating for that week if something 
seriously
> intruded on the schedule (but that's just me).
> 
> Just my 2 cents...
> 
> Ken


I have not followed this thread closely, BUT this thread and other 
posts screaming for Desktop upgrades bug me,  WHY did you but a palm 
if you do your data entry, etc. on a desktop/laptop????  Why bother 
with a palm at all if it is only a fancy gadget to carry around? Paper 
works just as good for carrying around info created on a desktop.  

I may be in the minority (although I doubt it) but I use the HH 
exclusively to do my input etc. I use it all day, not once a day.  The 
HH side work Jeff has done has been great at adding features, although 
I agree that the UI is becoming too cluttered and the program is 
becoming complicated to use.  The manual (and the website) need 
serious updating to eliminate old stuff no longer relevant and make it 
easier to understand (maybe Jeff needs someone else to do his amnual 
for him as programmers are not always the best people to communicate 
in simple, well organized terms.)

I would strongly vote against making Shadow a 'desktop driven' piece 
of software where I need a desktop to get full usage out of it.  The 
HH should not be a 'light' version of a desktop program, It should be 
THE program with the DT useful for data entry, export to other 
programs etc.  Jeff - keep the HH focus, do not let this become DT 
behemoth!

My 2 cents - (OK maybe 2 1/2)



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com

 

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

From: Frederick G. Turner  <fred@s...>
Date: