Yahoo! Groups
Groups Home - Yahoo! - Help



Welcome, Guest Register - Sign In 
shadow-discuss · Support for Shadow Plan outliner for Palm OS [ Join This Group! ]
  Home  
* Messages  
 
 
 Members Only 
  Chat  
  Files  
  Photos  
  Links  
  Polls  
  Members  
 
 
 Messages Messages Help
Collapse Messages
 
Using 29.6 of 512 MB (5%)
  4201-4301 of 10340  |  Previous | Next  [ First | Last ]
 
 Msg #   Date  |  Thread
4201

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 5:48pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:

> I am brand new to Shadow (using 2.1.0), and am trying to link some 
> ToDos from Datebk4 to a Shadow outline.
> 
> If I select "New From" and have ToDo highlighted, the list is only 
> showing me items with Priority of "1". How do I show items with lower 
> priorities?  I searched the Ref Guide and couldn't find any mention 
> of this in the "New From" section.

	Are you hitting down arrow (bottom right of the todo details
listing) to scroll down?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4202

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 5:53pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tim McPike wrote:

> 1) in the Item: New from: To Do -  it goes week by week.  But, usually the
> oldest outstanding items need to be attended to MORE than the more recent. 
> Going week by week is a really giant pain.
> 
> Solution - show a single list of ALL outstanding (unchecked) todos, rather than
> making us go week by week.  Make the list sortable by due date, todo category,
> or priority

	You might have 1000 todos, so narrowing down needs to be done (to
avoid running out of memory, and to keep it managable). Iwill be adding
category filtering. Got any other criterion that would makeit more useful?

> 2)in the Transfer: Import from Todo's - splitting into multiple lists.  This
> makes it a real pain to compile a single list.
> 
> Solution - can we get a single list?  If not, then option to import ONLY
> unchecked (as suggested earlier)

	Import unchecked will be going in.

	The reaosnit splits is due to many older units get whacky when
doing a pile of operations. I will have to re-evaluate that with the
average OS version and see how it goes.. that system was built 2 years ago
when units were a lot more primitive :)

> In any event, the import from To Do functions are extrememly a pain
> right now and keep me from using Shadow more extensively.

	Lets keep a discussion open then until we nail down how it should
work.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4203

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 5:54pm
Subject: Re: sorting Blank target dates and Priorities

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tim McPike wrote:

> Could we have an option to sort blank priorities and blank target dates LAST
> when sorting ASCENDING??

	Eventually; its on my todo list.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4204

From: Tim McPike  <tim@t...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 6:08pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
--- Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tim McPike wrote:
> 
> > 1) in the Item: New from: To Do -  it goes week by week.  But, usually the
> > oldest outstanding items need to be attended to MORE than the more recent. 
> > Going week by week is a really giant pain.
> > 
> > Solution - show a single list of ALL outstanding (unchecked) todos, rather
> than
> > making us go week by week.  Make the list sortable by due date, todo
> category,
> > or priority
> 
> 	You might have 1000 todos, so narrowing down needs to be done (to
> avoid running out of memory, and to keep it managable). Iwill be adding
> category filtering. Got any other criterion that would makeit more useful?

Priority filtering.  That would permit user to chose which To Dos would show up
in the import list by setting their priority (in the native To Do program). 
Filter could be:  "1, 2 and above, 3 and above" etc. or straight "1, 2, 3" so
if the number was too large, user could do incremental imports (first all the
1's, etc.)


> > 2)in the Transfer: Import from Todo's - splitting into multiple lists. 
> This
> > makes it a real pain to compile a single list.
> > 
> > Solution - can we get a single list?  If not, then option to import ONLY
> > unchecked (as suggested earlier)
> 
> 	Import unchecked will be going in.
> 
> 	The reaosnit splits is due to many older units get whacky when
> doing a pile of operations. I will have to re-evaluate that with the
> average OS version and see how it goes.. that system was built 2 years ago
> when units were a lot more primitive :)
> 
> > In any event, the import from To Do functions are extrememly a pain
> > right now and keep me from using Shadow more extensively.
> 
> 	Lets keep a discussion open then until we nail down how it should
> work.
> 

Definitely need more input beyond my experience.  And as always, don't mean to
sound negative.  Shadow Plan's a great program for so many things, really
appreciate your work, Jeff.

=====
************
Tim McPike
tim@t...

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
http://sports.yahoo.com
4205

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 6:40pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
Hi Jeff,

Thanks for the quick reply.

In my case, I only have 3 P1 ToDos for the current week (lucky me), 
so the arrow is not there.  There appears to be space for at least 3 
more ToDos below the existing 3 before the arrow would appear, if I 
understand your question correctly.

I also tried setting the pref for this list to use the normal To Do 
List instead of Datebk4 for the ToDo app, but it made no difference.  
It appears that this selection only looks at the ToDo db anyway, and 
does not use another app.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> 
> > I am brand new to Shadow (using 2.1.0), and am trying to link 
some 
> > ToDos from Datebk4 to a Shadow outline.
> > 
> > If I select "New From" and have ToDo highlighted, the list is 
only 
> > showing me items with Priority of "1". How do I show items with 
lower 
> > priorities?  I searched the Ref Guide and couldn't find any 
mention 
> > of this in the "New From" section.
> 
> 	Are you hitting down arrow (bottom right of the todo details
> listing) to scroll down?
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4206

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 6:57pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
A couple more datapoints:

1 - I tried creating a new todo in Palm ToDo, at P1, and it showed 
up.  Tried creating the same item as P3, and it didn't show up.

2 - In Datebk4, changed an existing P1 to P2 and it still showed up.

3 - In Datebk4, changed the same P1 to P3, P4, P5, and none of them 
showed up.

So it looks like I can only get P1 or P2 ToDos to show up in 
Shadow's "New From" dialog.  And it does not appear to be Datebk4 or 
ToDo app specific.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> Hi Jeff,
> 
> Thanks for the quick reply.
> 
> In my case, I only have 3 P1 ToDos for the current week (lucky me), 
> so the arrow is not there.  There appears to be space for at least 
3 
> more ToDos below the existing 3 before the arrow would appear, if I 
> understand your question correctly.
> 
> I also tried setting the pref for this list to use the normal To Do 
> List instead of Datebk4 for the ToDo app, but it made no 
difference.  
> It appears that this selection only looks at the ToDo db anyway, 
and 
> does not use another app.
> 
> Dave
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> > 
> > > I am brand new to Shadow (using 2.1.0), and am trying to link 
> some 
> > > ToDos from Datebk4 to a Shadow outline.
> > > 
> > > If I select "New From" and have ToDo highlighted, the list is 
> only 
> > > showing me items with Priority of "1". How do I show items with 
> lower 
> > > priorities?  I searched the Ref Guide and couldn't find any 
> mention 
> > > of this in the "New From" section.
> > 
> > 	Are you hitting down arrow (bottom right of the todo details
> > listing) to scroll down?
> > 
> > 		jeff
> > 
> > --
> > "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
> micro
> > circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> > sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
> is?"
> > -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4207

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 7:24pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Tim McPike wrote:

> Priority filtering.  That would permit user to chose which To Dos would show up
> in the import list by setting their priority (in the native To Do program). 
> Filter could be:  "1, 2 and above, 3 and above" etc. or straight "1, 2, 3" so
> if the number was too large, user could do incremental imports (first all the
> 1's, etc.)

	Perhaps still not enough - I know many people who put in 20 or 30
todos a day (they're thorough about minutia).

	How common is this, mind you?

	Or perhaps a search criterion is needed.

> Definitely need more input beyond my experience.  And as always, don't
> mean to sound negative.  Shadow Plan's a great program for so many
> things, really appreciate your work, Jeff.

	Danke.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4208

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 7:25pm
Subject: Re: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:

> I also tried setting the pref for this list to use the normal To Do 
> List instead of Datebk4 for the ToDo app, but it made no difference.  
> It appears that this selection only looks at the ToDo db anyway, and 
> does not use another app.

	Correct; the app setting is just for "gotos". Are you picking the
correct week?

		jeff

> 
> Dave
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> > 
> > > I am brand new to Shadow (using 2.1.0), and am trying to link 
> some 
> > > ToDos from Datebk4 to a Shadow outline.
> > > 
> > > If I select "New From" and have ToDo highlighted, the list is 
> only 
> > > showing me items with Priority of "1". How do I show items with 
> lower 
> > > priorities?  I searched the Ref Guide and couldn't find any 
> mention 
> > > of this in the "New From" section.
> > 
> > 	Are you hitting down arrow (bottom right of the todo details
> > listing) to scroll down?
> > 
> > 		jeff
> > 
> > --
> > "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
> micro
> > circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> > sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
> is?"
> > -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
> 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> 
>  
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> 
> 
> 

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4209

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 7:30pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
Yup, I'm picking the correct week.  As I mentioned, just changing the 
priority from 1/2 to 3/4/5 causes it to not show up in the list.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> 
> > I also tried setting the pref for this list to use the normal To 
Do 
> > List instead of Datebk4 for the ToDo app, but it made no 
difference.  
> > It appears that this selection only looks at the ToDo db anyway, 
and 
> > does not use another app.
> 
> 	Correct; the app setting is just for "gotos". Are you picking 
the
> correct week?
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> > > On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> > > 
> > > > I am brand new to Shadow (using 2.1.0), and am trying to link 
> > some 
> > > > ToDos from Datebk4 to a Shadow outline.
> > > > 
> > > > If I select "New From" and have ToDo highlighted, the list is 
> > only 
> > > > showing me items with Priority of "1". How do I show items 
with 
> > lower 
> > > > priorities?  I searched the Ref Guide and couldn't find any 
> > mention 
> > > > of this in the "New From" section.
> > > 
> > > 	Are you hitting down arrow (bottom right of the todo details
> > > listing) to scroll down?
> > > 
> > > 		jeff
> > > 
> > > --
> > > "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your 
own 
> > micro
> > > circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I 
mean,
> > > sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate 
he 
> > is?"
> > > -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@e...
> > 
> >  
> > 
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to 
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4210

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 7:48pm
Subject: Re: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:

> Yup, I'm picking the correct week.  As I mentioned, just changing the 
> priority from 1/2 to 3/4/5 causes it to not show up in the list.

	Hmm, okay, so a sorting issue then, most likely. Is your todo
sorting after these changes?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4211

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:25pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
If I change a P3 to a P1 or P2, it moves up higher in the list (in 
both Datebk4 and the "New From" list).  If I change a P1 to a P2, it 
moves down in both.  If I change a P1 to P3, it moves down in 
Datebk4, and disappears from the "New From" list when I get back into 
Shadow.

Is that what you mean?

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> 
> > Yup, I'm picking the correct week.  As I mentioned, just changing 
the 
> > priority from 1/2 to 3/4/5 causes it to not show up in the list.
> 
> 	Hmm, okay, so a sorting issue then, most likely. Is your todo
> sorting after these changes?
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4212

From: Tad Davis  <davist@i...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:34pm
Subject: Some more wish list items

 
I tried buttering Jeff up privately, but it didn't work. The guy is
incorruptible.

So here's my wish list. I think one or the other of these may have come
up a long time ago, and been shot down for one reason or another, but
hope springs eternal.

[1] The Suppress Indentation option is OK, but what I'd really like to
see is a way to specify how much indentation, or to select from none /
small / medium. It appears to me that Shadow indents about 4 spaces, or
what I consider medium; I'd like it to be only 2.

[2] In tracking progress on a task list, it's useful to see (quickly)
the target dates for items that are due, but the completed date for
items that are completed. It would be nice to have an option to this
effect in the Customized view. Both would be filled in and stored as
before, but one or the other would display in the list view, depending
on status. As Jeff has pointed out in other contexts, the built-in To Do
list works this way, mainly because it only has one date; but it's a
useful way of looking at project items anyway.

---------------------------------------------------------
Tad Davis        215-898-7864        davist@i...
---------------------------------------------------------
4213

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:27pm
Subject: Re: Re: Moving items to another file

 
At 05:37 AM 02/21/2002, Jeff wrote:
>         I'll be adding a Merge lists option sometime.

Will we be able to merge parts of lists? For instance, I have an outline 
with several projects and another for things to do this week. Would I be 
able to select one or two sections of my projects outline and merge it with 
my this-week outline?

Mostly I'm just curious. In any case, it sounds like an awesome feature.

Nancy
4214

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:56pm
Subject: Re: Re: Moving items to another file

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002 oooieoo@k... wrote:

> >         I'll be adding a Merge lists option sometime.
> 
> Will we be able to merge parts of lists? For instance, I have an outline 
> with several projects and another for things to do this week. Would I be 
> able to select one or two sections of my projects outline and merge it with 
> my this-week outline?

	Thats what the multi clip is for :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4215

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:41pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
At 09:34 AM 02/21/2002, Tim wrote:
>1) in the Item: New from: To Do -  it goes week by week.  But, usually the
>oldest outstanding items need to be attended to MORE than the more recent.
>Going week by week is a really giant pain.
>
>Solution - show a single list of ALL outstanding (unchecked) todos, rather 
>than
>making us go week by week.  Make the list sortable by due date, todo category,
>or priority

I soooo agree with you on this. The 'New From' has so much potential, yet I 
never use it because it's such a hassle to find what I want.


>The assumption that we'll work from Shadow exclusively after an initial import
>may or may not be true.  Even if true, there will be occasions when folks will
>need to start fresh or round up stray, unsynched items.

There are also those of us using Actioneer as a "dumping ground" on the 
fly. Rounding those up would be something I'd be very interested in doing 
from Shadow.

Nancy
4216

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 8:56pm
Subject: Re: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
At 11:48 AM 02/21/2002, you wrote:
>On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
>
> > Yup, I'm picking the correct week.  As I mentioned, just changing the
> > priority from 1/2 to 3/4/5 causes it to not show up in the list.

In another note you mentioned that you also tried 'New From' using the ToDo 
"tab," so I'm not sure if my theory is correct, but....

Is it possible that within DateBk4 you have your view set to show only 
Priority 1 ToDos and somehow this might be effecting what you see?

Nancy
4217

From: smasters@a...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:09pm
Subject: RE: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
Jeff said:

...I'm betting the List Opt "show all" will be the choice (as usual,
since everyone likes options :)...

Jeff,
Just my opinion here, but I hate to see us get too carried away with
preference settings. As an iterative process these are easier to keep up
with, but it seems to be getting a little overwhelming for new users. Maybe
I'm wrong, but set-up seems to be creeping up on your support list.

Scott
4218

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:00pm
Subject: Re: Re: Moving items to another file

 
At 12:56 PM 02/21/2002, you wrote:
>On Thu, 21 Feb 2002 oooieoo@k... wrote:
>
> > >         I'll be adding a Merge lists option sometime.
> >
> > Will we be able to merge parts of lists? For instance, I have an outline
> > with several projects and another for things to do this week. Would I be
> > able to select one or two sections of my projects outline and merge it 
> with
> > my this-week outline?
>
>         Thats what the multi clip is for :)

Oh.

Nancy ::hanging my head::
4219

From: casonbang  <newstuff@i...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:20pm
Subject: Re: Clie and Handera folks! (my HandEra wishes)

 
Actually I think the smallest system font on the HandEra is the same as the standard PalmOS font.  In that case you could just reuse the low-res widgets.

I agree though, the whole resolution situation is quite ridiculous.  Good luck.
4220

From: jeff.resener@s...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:27pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
<snip>

I soooo agree with you on this. The 'New From' has so much potential, yet I

never use it because it's such a hassle to find what I want.

>The assumption that we'll work from Shadow exclusively after an initial
import
>may or may not be true.  Even if true, there will be occasions when folks
will
>need to start fresh or round up stray, unsynched items.

There are also those of us using Actioneer as a "dumping ground" on the
fly. Rounding those up would be something I'd be very interested in doing
from Shadow.
<snip>

I agree on this one. I *try* to use Shadow as my primary task management
list, however during the day I have many times when I just want to jot it
down, before I forget it. Actioneer lets me do this quite nicely, and does
put it into the ToDo list (by category) as I set it, but often I want
really to see these with all my other work so that I can prioritize
workload. Right now, just not real easy to bring them back into shadow, so
I end up planning from Shadow, linking to the ToDo, then in the ToDo having
to reassign priorities of the stragglers from Actioneer. Actually if
Actioneer was more flexible in letting the use decide where to put ToDos it
would be even better, but I haven't seen anydevelopment there for quite
some time.
jeff
4221

From: fiatspider72  <fiatspider72@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:41pm
Subject: Re: Weighted tasks

 
> Of course, when weights get added, the default weighting will be 1
> (just like it is now). (ie: IF you have 5 items, then its the total
> completion divided by 5.. thus theyr'e all weight 1 now)

I there any chance that we could get the percentage complete from a 
linked list?  This could really be handy!

 - Jeramy
4222

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:49pm
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
Hi Nancy,

I can see all the todos in Datebk4 and the built-in ToDo program, but 
only the P1 or P2 todos show up when trying to link them from within 
Shadow.

It appears to be purely a function of the todo priority.  P1 & P2 
show up in Shadow, P3 & P4  & P5 don't show up in Shadow.  However, 
they all show up in Datebk4 and the ToDo app.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., oooieoo@k... wrote:
> At 09:34 AM 02/21/2002, Tim wrote:
> >1) in the Item: New from: To Do -  it goes week by week.  But, 
usually the
> >oldest outstanding items need to be attended to MORE than the more 
recent.
> >Going week by week is a really giant pain.
> >
> >Solution - show a single list of ALL outstanding (unchecked) 
todos, rather 
> >than
> >making us go week by week.  Make the list sortable by due date, 
todo category,
> >or priority
> 
> I soooo agree with you on this. The 'New From' has so much 
potential, yet I 
> never use it because it's such a hassle to find what I want.
> 
> 
> >The assumption that we'll work from Shadow exclusively after an 
initial import
> >may or may not be true.  Even if true, there will be occasions 
when folks will
> >need to start fresh or round up stray, unsynched items.
> 
> There are also those of us using Actioneer as a "dumping ground" on 
the 
> fly. Rounding those up would be something I'd be very interested in 
doing 
> from Shadow.
> 
> Nancy
4223

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:45pm
Subject: Re: Re: Todo import feature

 
I wrote:
> >>There are also those of us using Actioneer as a "dumping ground" on the
>fly. Rounding those up would be something I'd be very interested in doing
>from Shadow.<<
>
>Jeff wrote:
>I agree on this one. I *try* to use Shadow as my primary task management
>list, however during the day I have many times when I just want to jot it
>down, before I forget it. Actioneer lets me do this quite nicely, and does
>put it into the ToDo list (by category) as I set it, but often I want
>really to see these with all my other work so that I can prioritize
>workload. Right now, just not real easy to bring them back into shadow, so
>I end up planning from Shadow, linking to the ToDo, then in the ToDo having
>to reassign priorities of the stragglers from Actioneer. Actually if
>Actioneer was more flexible in letting the use decide where to put ToDos it
>would be even better, but I haven't seen anydevelopment there for quite
>some time.

Well, I'm a latecomer to Actioneer, but reading how so many others were 
using it encouraged me to try it out. It was exactly what I needed-- the 
missing link, as it were, in the way I had everything set up. When in a 
hurry, I would just tend to write things down on paper because it was 
faster than trying to think about where I wanted to do the input on my 
Palm. While it would be cool to be able to choose Shadow as a place to dump 
to from Actioneer, for now I'd rather that it just stay simple. That's what 
makes it so nice to use. Then again, using Shadow is getting easier, the 
more I use it, so I may eventually drift into just using it as a dumping 
ground. :D

n.
4224

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 9:50pm
Subject: Re: Re: Todo import feature

 
At 01:49 PM 02/21/2002, Dave wrote:
>Hi Nancy,
>
>I can see all the todos in Datebk4 and the built-in ToDo program, but
>only the P1 or P2 todos show up when trying to link them from within
>Shadow.
>
>It appears to be purely a function of the todo priority.  P1 & P2
>show up in Shadow, P3 & P4  & P5 don't show up in Shadow.  However,
>they all show up in Datebk4 and the ToDo app.


That's very weird, Dave. It's working great on my Palm (Vx). I wonder what 
the problem could be? I'm assuming you have the latest/greatest versions of 
DateBk4 and ShodowPlan? :-)

Nancy
4225

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 10:25pm
Subject: RE: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002 smasters@a... wrote:

> Just my opinion here, but I hate to see us get too carried away with
> preference settings. As an iterative process these are easier to keep up
> with, but it seems to be getting a little overwhelming for new users. Maybe
> I'm wrong, but set-up seems to be creeping up on your support list.

	You know, I'm half tempted all the time to revamp the UI and
prefs. For Shadow 3, I might just look into rearranging larger scale
things.. ie: Having List Opt and List Custom is a little extreme.. they
overlap. So they should be combined and made into a better more intuitive
system. (Sort of like how I brought the 3 global prefs panels into 1
central pref menu item, even though its 3 separate panels still)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4226

From: fiatspider72  <fiatspider72@y...>
Date: Thu Feb 21, 2002 3:27pm
Subject: Re: Weighted tasks (feature request?)

 
> 	Of course, when weights get added, the default weighting will 
be 1
> (just like it is now). (ie: IF you have 5 items, then its the total
> completion divided by 5.. thus theyr'e all weight 1 now)

Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but what about the %
age complete from linked lists?  I just ran into this shortcoming 
this weekend.

In the example above, List A has 5 items and Item 1 is linked to List 
B that has 5 items.

Currently, the %age complete of List B has no affect on the %age 
complete of List A=>Item 1.  So List A would have % completeness of 
0%, 20%, 40%, 60%, 80%, or 100% (that is unless its % is manually set 
in the details of any item).

But in reality, List A=>Item 1 could have the same values for % 
complete and, if the value "rolled-up" from the linked list it would 
give a more accurate view of completeness.  This of course this can 
be accomplished manually, but you must remember to do it.

The only down side that I can see is probably run-time speed.  Ex: 
you open a list that is linked to 5 lists (SP now has to look at 6 
lists) and each one of those is linked to another 5 (now 26 
lists!),..... yipes!
4227

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:39am
Subject: Re: Re: Weighted tasks (feature request?)

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, fiatspider72 wrote:

> Forgive me if this has already been discussed, but what about the %
> age complete from linked lists?  I just ran into this shortcoming 
> this weekend.
> 
> In the example above, List A has 5 items and Item 1 is linked to List 
> B that has 5 items.
> 
> Currently, the %age complete of List B has no affect on the %age 

	Correct. Complex dependancies between lists aren't yet
implemented.. its very complex to do without killing performance. Its in
the todo, but will be awhile.

> complete and, if the value "rolled-up" from the linked list it would 
> give a more accurate view of completeness.  This of course this can 
> be accomplished manually, but you must remember to do it.

	Item to item linking will have to be implemented first; I don't
think list %age's will be as needed as linking to other items for %age.

> The only down side that I can see is probably run-time speed.  Ex: 
> you open a list that is linked to 5 lists (SP now has to look at 6 
> lists) and each one of those is linked to another 5 (now 26 
> lists!),..... yipes!

	Yep, exactly :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4228

From: Thieme.Geoff  <geoffthieme@y...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 2:50am
Subject: RE: Week starts on Monday vs Sunday

 
What about a "Linked todo items" filter? It would display items that have a
todo linked w/them. This would allow a me to accomplish the same thing as a
"This week's target items" filter starting on Monday (vs Sunday). Every week
I could schedule/prioritize a weekly task list filtered from a master task
list. I could then view just my weekly list anytime during that week. Plus
it would be quicker for large master task lists. Quicker to load the Shadow
list and take less steps to make a weekly list from the master.

A. "This week's target items" filter - Small list steps:
Note: Any tasks added to the list are automatically given a linked todo
w/priority=5 (I consider priority=5 to be un-prioritized). This slows list
loading.
1) Schedule each task (while suffering from information overload of viewing
all my tasks at once).
2) Apply This week's target items filter. Now only this weeks tasks are
shown.
3) Prioritize each task.

B. "This week's target items" filter - Large list steps:
Note: Any tasks added to the list are given a priority=5 w/no linked todo.
1) Determine this weeks tasks by adding linked todo (check the T box) for
each one (while suffering from information overload of viewing all my tasks
at once).
2) Also, for each of the tasks above, set the target date for today (I do
weekly planning on Mondays). This step is done so I don't suffer from
information overload when scheduling/prioritizing this weeks handful of
tasks listed alongside a hundred other tasks.
3) Apply This week's target items filter. Now only this weeks tasks are
shown.
4) Schedule each task (for actual target date, probably not Monday).
5) Prioritize each task.

C. "Linked todo items" filter - Small and Large list steps:
Note: Any tasks added to the list are given a priority=5 w/no linked todo.
With this option, the Linked todo items filter acts like a weekly item
filter.
1) Determine this weeks tasks by adding linked todo (check the T box) for
each one (while suffering from information overload of viewing all my tasks
at once).
2) Apply Linked todo items filter. Now only this weeks tasks are shown.
3) Schedule each task.
4) Prioritize each task

This week's target items filter works better for small task lists (A). It
takes less steps, plus loading time and information overload are not issues.
Linked todo items filter (C) works better for larger lists (like mine
is/will be). It takes less steps, plus loading time and information overload
are greater issues. Since I have a large list (which will soon become much
larger), I will end up using B unless C becomes an option. The Shadow lists
in options B and C load twice as fast as A on my CLIE w/100 list items. Step
1 in option C takes place of steps 1 & 2 in option B; besides killing 2
birds w/one stone, existing target dates I had previously specified would
not be lost.

In my life planning efforts (over the last year) I've found the simpler the
better. If its not simple, it won't get used.

Does anybody else here use Shadow Plan for life planning? For more info on
what I'm talking about, see
http://www.writingonyourpalm.net/column010806.htm and
http://www.writingonyourpalm.net/planning.htm .

Later,
Geoff

-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Mitchell [mailto:skeezix@s...]
Sent: Wednesday, February 20, 2002 2:31 PM
To: 'shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com'
Cc: Thieme.Geoff
Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Week starts on Monday vs Sunday


On Wed, 20 Feb 2002, Thieme.Geoff wrote:

> use a weekly list and a monthly list. I decided to use just one list to
> simplify things. Now I just need a "This week's target items" filter that
> starts w/Monday. I have tried using weeks that start w/Sunday, but it is
> just not compatible w/my planning style. What do you think of adding a
This
> week's target items that starts w/Monday, using the Palm's Monday/Sunday
> week start preferences, or adding a Shadow Monday/Sunday week start pref?

	I'll look into it; I forget how week begining is determined in
those routines, so I don't know how complex a change it is, or how far
reaching.

	btw; Dont' send to bot hthe mailing lists and support -- I don't
need to get it twice ;)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
4229

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 3:01am
Subject: RE: Week starts on Monday vs Sunday

 
On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Thieme.Geoff wrote:

> What about a "Linked todo items" filter? It would display items that have a
> todo linked w/them. This would allow a me to accomplish the same thing as a
> "This week's target items" filter starting on Monday (vs Sunday). Every week
> I could schedule/prioritize a weekly task list filtered from a master task
> list. I could then view just my weekly list anytime during that week. Plus
> it would be quicker for large master task lists. Quicker to load the Shadow
> list and take less steps to make a weekly list from the master.

	I can add a filter for linked (or not linked) items very
easily. Its been requested before.

	Select "items with todo or datebook link" and "items without todo
or datebook link". Good?

	Gotta run.. I'll reply rest later.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4230

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 3:47am
Subject: VFS/cards

 
Do you want it like this?

	1) You hit the category popmenu in the top right of the file
selection screen

	2) You pick "Card"

	3) The file listing gets updated with a list of files from the
"Shadow Plan" directory on your card

	4) Pick a file, and it is *copied* into Palm normal memory and
read from there

	5) When you save the file, it is copied back to the VFS card

	6) when you close the list (exit that list), the "temp" file is
removed from palm memory

	Reading and writing directly to the card can come, but its much
more work, so I'm debating options.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4231

From: geoffthieme  <geoffthieme@y...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 6:24am
Subject: Re: Week starts on Monday vs Sunday

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Feb 2002, Thieme.Geoff wrote:
> 
> > What about a "Linked todo items" filter? It would display items 
that have a
> > todo linked w/them. This would allow a me to accomplish the same 
thing as a
> > "This week's target items" filter starting on Monday (vs Sunday). 
Every week
> > I could schedule/prioritize a weekly task list filtered from a 
master task
> > list. I could then view just my weekly list anytime during that 
week. Plus
> > it would be quicker for large master task lists. Quicker to load 
the Shadow
> > list and take less steps to make a weekly list from the master.
> 
> 	I can add a filter for linked (or not linked) items very
> easily. Its been requested before.
> 
> 	Select "items with todo or datebook link" and "items without 
todo
> or datebook link". Good?
> 
> 	Gotta run.. I'll reply rest later.
> 
> 		jeff

Perfect! :)
Let me know if you need a beta tester.

Just to verify... only todo or datebook linked items would be 
included in the filter, items with address or memo would not. Correct?

I find the "items with todo or datebook link" filter more useful than 
the "items without todo or datebook link" filter. An "items with todo 
or datebook link" highlight may be useful while I am choosing tasks 
to be filtered by.
For me, the "items with todo or datebook link" filter is most 
important. Once that feature is available I can start weekly planning 
again.

Thanks for all your help,
Geoff
4232

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 6:37am
Subject: Re: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
<snip>

> 
> 	I'm betting the List Opt "show all" will be the choice (as usual,
> since everyone likes options :).. so those who want to see it all,
> could. The idea is they wish to have task items (say), but only
display
> days-till-due, perhaps.. but they still need ti edit %ages and such.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
<snip2...the sequel...>

Maybe this holds the answer to the "does the item count for %age"
question.

What if you add an option (simple checkbox) to check on items if you
wanted it excluded from %age calculation.  Maybe even a way to set the
defaults for each item type, either globally or per list?

That way there'd be no contradiction between "not showing" and "not
counted".  Especially in light of the above...

Or is this the same thing as a weight of zero?  hmmmmm

Ken
4233

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 7:09am
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> If I change a P3 to a P1 or P2, it moves up higher in the list (in 
> both Datebk4 and the "New From" list).  If I change a P1 to a P2,
it 
> moves down in both.  If I change a P1 to P3, it moves down in 
> Datebk4, and disappears from the "New From" list when I get back
into 
> Shadow.
> 
> Is that what you mean?
> 
> Dave
> 
<snip>

Can I pop in and ask a question?  (oops, already did! :) )

Are your non-priority 1 tasks dated?

Jeff,

I was playing around to see if I could recreate this situation.  I
could only get the item to *not* show up when it was undated.  Which,
unfortunately, seems to mean that there is a bug in the "undated"
checkbox on the "New From" screen.

Ken  (just my 2 cents...)
4234

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 7:50am
Subject: Re: Todo import feature

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., jeff.resener@s... wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> 
> I soooo agree with you on this. The 'New From' has so much
potential, yet I
> 
> never use it because it's such a hassle to find what I want.
> 

<snip>

> I agree on this one. I *try* to use Shadow as my primary task
management
> list, however during the day I have many times when I just want to
jot it
> down, before I forget it. Actioneer lets me do this quite nicely,
and does
> put it into the ToDo list (by category) as I set it, but often I
want
> really to see these with all my other work so that I can prioritize
> workload. Right now, just not real easy to bring them back into
shadow, so
> I end up planning from Shadow, linking to the ToDo, then in the ToDo
having
> to reassign priorities of the stragglers from Actioneer. Actually if
> Actioneer was more flexible in letting the use decide where to put
ToDos it
> would be even better, but I haven't seen anydevelopment there for
quite
> some time.
> jeff

I'm going to jump in here with an OT remark (sort of)...

I tried Actioneer and quite frankly I think it flies in the face of
the GTD philosophy!  One of the main precepts of GTD is to do things
together *where* you do them.  This, to me, means capturing
information when its available, and doing things like prioritizing,
categorizing in their place.

Actioneer separates these two activities, when in essence the
information and its categorization generally come from the same source
and are done in the same "place" (@Palm, if you will).  For me, its
@Datebk4!  Hit New, Todo and I'm there... although you may want to
look at SmartInput, which lets you set attribution *and* distribute to
other apps...

(as a *complete* aside, I've given up on Memos completely.  I can't
find any reason for an "unassociated" note to myself.  So my notes are
either SP lists under some greater objective, a note on a Todo/Appt, or
a Daily Journal entry.  All of which are linkable to SP and easier to
find and organize!)

That aside, I agree with the need for "New From" improvement.  Other
apps are better geared for capturing the information because they're
quicker than SP.  What comes at you first is the ToDo proper, then
maybe you also get "when", "what category", etc.  In SP, I'd have to
stop and think where I'd want to put this...  If I were to keep a
"scratch" list in SP, it'd be no better than Memos (ok, slightly
better)  At least in DateBk4 (like the builtin ToDo) its self sorting
and date indexed, not to mention that its then in front of me while
I'm working...

However, I always take the time to "New From" into SP, so I can "put
it all together" in my mind.  I specifically leave out day to day
ToDos because I have no "cross purpose" to connect them together,
they're one-timers and I don't need anything but a record of
completion (DateBk4!).

Mind you I still create ToDos from SP when I'm using it (meeting
notes, organizing the "future", etc.) but moment to moment I usually
have DBK4 open 'cause I'm *doing* my ToDos and its "ToDo central" to me...

..whew... that got long winded!
Come to think of it, I'm not sure exactly what brought all that on...
maybe I'm just looking for validation :)

But now that I've typed it all in.... I'm posting it!

Ken
4235

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:16am
Subject: Re: Re: Todo import feature

 
Didn't the GTD guru, David Allen have something to do with Actioneer's 
beginnings? For what it's worth, I think how you work would determine 
whether Actioneer "flies in the face" of GTD, or not. For me, it's a step 
above the "dumping ground" I was using before. My dumping ground could be 
likened to a Palmtop "Inbox." Now it's just an inbox that's a lot more 
usable on the fly. When I've had a chance to sit down and review what's 
what, I can then take the time to see what I need to do next, or save 
everything for a larger review at the end of the day.

Nancy


------------------------------
At 11:50 PM 02/21/2002, you wrote:
>I'm going to jump in here with an OT remark (sort of)...
>
>I tried Actioneer and quite frankly I think it flies in the face of
>the GTD philosophy!  One of the main precepts of GTD is to do things
>together *where* you do them.  This, to me, means capturing
>information when its available, and doing things like prioritizing,
>categorizing in their place.

<snip
4236

From: Ray Drew  <ray_drew@y...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:31am
Subject: Re: VFS/cards

 
On Friday, February 22, 2002 3:47 AM Jeff Mitchell wrote:

<<<
      Do you want it like this?

      1) You hit the category popmenu in the top right of the file
selection screen

      2) You pick "Card"

      3) The file listing gets updated with a list of files from the
"Shadow Plan" directory on your card

      4) Pick a file, and it is *copied* into Palm normal memory and
read from there

      5) When you save the file, it is copied back to the VFS card

      6) when you close the list (exit that list), the "temp" file is
removed from palm memory

      Reading and writing directly to the card can come, but its much
more work, so I'm debating options.

            jeff

>>>

Jeff,

I got a 16mb sd card free with my palm m505. I haven't used it yet so I'm not aware of all the issues but what you suggest sounds quite practical to me.

Ray


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
4237

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:11pm
Subject: Re: Re: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, kenclatham wrote:

> Maybe this holds the answer to the "does the item count for %age"
> question.
> 
> What if you add an option (simple checkbox) to check on items if you
> wanted it excluded from %age calculation.  Maybe even a way to set the
> defaults for each item type, either globally or per list?
> 
> That way there'd be no contradiction between "not showing" and "not
> counted".  Especially in light of the above...
> 
> Or is this the same thing as a weight of zero?  hmmmmm

	Thats interesting.

	So a rule of..

	If it displays a checkbox or %age then it counts towards %age,
unless its weight is zero (natch).

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4238

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 1:39pm
Subject: Re: "New From" only showing P1 ToDos

 
I don't think I am clearly explaining the problem.  Sorry for the 
confusion.  Let me try again. :-)

1 - In Datebk4 or built-in ToDo app, create a todo called "Test" 
dated today, with priority 1.

2 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will show "Test" 
along with any other todos of priority 1 or 2 in the current week.

3 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the priority 
of "Test" from 1 to 3.

4 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *not* 
show item "Test" but will only show those items still with priority 1 
or 2.

5 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the priority 
of "Test" back to 1 or 2.

6 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *show* 
item "Test" again.

I am using a Sony Clie n760 w/ OS 4.1, Datebk4 V-5.0a, pJ (latest 
beta), and Shadow 2.1.0.  However, I see the exact same behavior 
using the built-in ToDo app instead of Datebk4.

Hope that is a bit clearer.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:

> Can I pop in and ask a question?  (oops, already did! :) )
> 
> Are your non-priority 1 tasks dated?
> 
> Jeff,
> 
> I was playing around to see if I could recreate this situation.  I
> could only get the item to *not* show up when it was undated.  
Which,
> unfortunately, seems to mean that there is a bug in the "undated"
> checkbox on the "New From" screen.
> 
> Ken  (just my 2 cents...)
4239

From: Tim McPike  <tim@t...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 4:00pm
Subject: Re: Re: Todo import feature

 
--- kenclatham <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> 
> Actioneer separates these two activities, when in essence the
> information and its categorization generally come from the same source
> and are done in the same "place" (@Palm, if you will).  For me, its
> @Datebk4!  Hit New, Todo and I'm there... although you may want to
> look at SmartInput, which lets you set attribution *and* distribute to
> other apps...

Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, I think Actioneer handles @place automatically.
 I have a pretty thorough keyword list set up in Actioneer that automatically
plugs in my Places (categories), e.g. "get milk" gets put in ToDo at "Errands"
by Actioneer because of the "get" keyword.

> 
> That aside, I agree with the need for "New From" improvement.  Other
> apps are better geared for capturing the information because they're
> quicker than SP.  What comes at you first is the ToDo proper, then
> maybe you also get "when", "what category", etc.  In SP, I'd have to
> stop and think where I'd want to put this...  If I were to keep a
> "scratch" list in SP, it'd be no better than Memos (ok, slightly
> better)  At least in DateBk4 (like the builtin ToDo) its self sorting
> and date indexed, not to mention that its then in front of me while
> I'm working...

I agree with that.  DB4 todo input is faster that ShadowPlan.  I tend to use it
or Actioneer depending on how fast I need to input it and  how much time I have
to process it -- Actioneer for total on the fly, DB4 for a little day planning.

> 
> However, I always take the time to "New From" into SP, so I can "put
> it all together" in my mind.  I specifically leave out day to day
> ToDos because I have no "cross purpose" to connect them together,
> they're one-timers and I don't need anything but a record of
> completion (DateBk4!).

I, on the other hand, like to bring them into Shadowplan, even the minor
routine ToDo's, AT LEAST once they've been carried over a day cuz they didn't
get done on the day of entry.  

That's because I'm using ShadowPlan as a Grasscatcher List that contains BOTH
the ToDos that are in the Palm native ToDo, which means I've "committed" to
getting them done AND my grasscatcher items.  I like see my total load in
Shadow, and keep my "okay, you GOTTA do these" in ToDo.  

A la Dave Allen, my REAL DROP DEAD gotta dos go in DB as appointments.

=====
************
Tim McPike
tim@t...

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
http://sports.yahoo.com
4240

From: sdm42us  <smasters@a...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 5:41pm
Subject: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Okay,
I just changed from an M100 to a Clie T415. I had to reinstall Palm 
Desktop to get the hotsync to work. I've got most everything back on 
the T415, but how do i get the main database records back in? If I 
look at Palm\Master\Address, I can see that the records are in 
Address.bak, but how do I get it into Palm desktop and sync it to my 
Clie? Thanks for the help.

Scott
4241

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 5:52pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, sdm42us wrote:

> I just changed from an M100 to a Clie T415. I had to reinstall Palm 
> Desktop to get the hotsync to work. I've got most everything back on 
> the T415, but how do i get the main database records back in? If I 
> look at Palm\Master\Address, I can see that the records are in 
> Address.bak, but how do I get it into Palm desktop and sync it to my 
> Clie? Thanks for the help.

	*g* "Somewhat off topic"?

	Its actually a pain; Hotsync Manager doesn't back up the built in
databases "per se". Its a lot easier to go from one unit to another idf
you're using backup buddy or the like :/

	Did you call the ujit the same name? or a new name?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4242

From: gbjerke  <gbjerke@y...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 5:53pm
Subject: Synch @ Home and @ Work?

 
If I get another copy of the desktop can I synch both at home and at 
work?  Anything I should know if I want to do this?  Thanks.
4243

From: smasters@a...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 6:00pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Same name. I tried to just update Palm desktop by installing "palm desktop
for Clie" over the top of the existing, but desktop and hotsync didn't seem
to like that. So I uninstalled Palm desktop and installed palm desktop for
Clie. But of course nothing shows up in the desktop now. I installed
everything that was in the Backup folder, so i think that all I'm missing
are the 4 main databases. I still have everything on the M100 for now. Is
there an "easy" way to beam everything over to the Clie? One at a time
would be pretty rough. Thanks for your help Jeff.

Scott
4244

From: smasters@a...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 6:47pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Hello again,

I used the "beam category" in ToDo, Address, and Memopad to get everything
to the Clie from the M100, and that worked well in just 1/2 hr. Any
suggestions for datebook? I really hate the idea of beaming one at a time.
Any other options? Also reinstalled SP2.1 to get conduit back and it seems
to be syncing fine.   Thanks again for the help.

Scott
4245

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 6:43pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Scott, no matter how you end up doing this, make a copy of your backup 
files and move them somewhere else on your computer. If something goes 
wonky, don't move the actual copies to your backup folder. Make a copy of 
the copy to move.

Nancy


--------------

At 10:00 AM 02/22/2002, you wrote:

>Same name. I tried to just update Palm desktop by installing "palm desktop
>for Clie" over the top of the existing, but desktop and hotsync didn't seem
>to like that. So I uninstalled Palm desktop and installed palm desktop for
>Clie. But of course nothing shows up in the desktop now. I installed
>everything that was in the Backup folder, so i think that all I'm missing
>are the 4 main databases. I still have everything on the M100 for now. Is
>there an "easy" way to beam everything over to the Clie? One at a time
>would be pretty rough. Thanks for your help Jeff.
>
>Scott
4246

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:04pm
Subject: Re: Synch @ Home and @ Work?

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, gbjerke wrote:

> If I get another copy of the desktop can I synch both at home and at 
> work?  Anything I should know if I want to do this?  Thanks.

	Sure can; the registration carries with you, so you can sync
anywhere. There are some gotchas..

	Due to the fact you can sync anywhere, anytime, at any number of
machines (you might have home and work, and then go to a friends or
laptop..) Shadow has to figure out the "source of truth" when comparing
the same item on both sides, if its not the same location you synced at
"last sync". So, for instance, if you sync at home and all is well, then
you change something and sycn at work, and then at your laptop.. Sjhadow
has to say "hmm, I guess I'm syncing at the source of truth now".. but it
is very dificult to know. IT cannot tell, in these cases, which item is
newer, all the time.. so to save you and protect your changes, Shadow will
often keep both items.. the changed one, and the "other old/other
one".. so you may see items duplicated unless you're careful.

	I'll be improving this logic in the future, but it is very complex
and may not always be the way you need it :/

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4247

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:07pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002 smasters@a... wrote:

> 
> Same name. I tried to just update Palm desktop by installing "palm desktop
> for Clie" over the top of the existing, but desktop and hotsync didn't seem
> to like that. So I uninstalled Palm desktop and installed palm desktop for
> Clie. But of course nothing shows up in the desktop now. I installed
> everything that was in the Backup folder, so i think that all I'm missing
> are the 4 main databases. I still have everything on the M100 for now. Is
> there an "easy" way to beam everything over to the Clie? One at a time
> would be pretty rough. Thanks for your help Jeff.

	In general, its like this:

	1) Uninstall old palm desktop
	2) Install new one (ideally, to same place; install the Clie stuff
into your Handspring directory, if you had a Visor, for example)
	3) When asked, do not create a new user.. pick the old user!
	4) Restoration brings back everything

	I've always used a backup tool to get PDB's of the built ins.. but
in theory, it shoudl work without that..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4248

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:08pm
Subject: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
Jeff,

When attempting to open a rather large list on my HH, I got a BAD 
LOAD error message.  Knowing I had a copy on the desktop, I deleted 
the HH file and got some funny results.

Initially, the HH file looked like it got deleted but the process 
left an un-named file in memory with 226 (records, entries, ?) to the 
far right on the main screen for opening SP lists.  All my other 
files appear untouched.

Getting into SP DT, I tagged the file for upload and hot-synched.  No 
dice.

Looking into the lastsynch.txt file, I spied a message indicating 
that SP tried to load the file but bypassed it stating the original 
file (on the HH, I'm presuming) didn't have a header record.

I still have the file on the DT (suitably copied for a double 
backup), but I still can't get it loaded to the HH.

This isn't a major problem right now (I dropped it down to a .txt 
file and finished my corrections) but I still want it on the HH 
eventually.

Any suggestions ?
4249

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:09pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002 smasters@a... wrote:

> I used the "beam category" in ToDo, Address, and Memopad to get everything
> to the Clie from the M100, and that worked well in just 1/2 hr. Any
> suggestions for datebook? I really hate the idea of beaming one at a time.
> Any other options? Also reinstalled SP2.1 to get conduit back and it seems
> to be syncing fine.   Thanks again for the help.

	What launcher? If you're using Silverscreen (or others), you can
just send the database.. in Silverscreen, you list mode, expand the
databases under the application, and beam DatebookDB..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4250

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:14pm
Subject: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> Looking into the lastsynch.txt file, I spied a message indicating 
> that SP tried to load the file but bypassed it stating the original 
> file (on the HH, I'm presuming) didn't have a header record.

	So the file did not actully get deleted. Weird. Try deleting it
again.. sometimes if a file is "funny" the OS takes a couple deletions
before it actually disappears.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4251

From: smasters@a...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:22pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Jeff asked:
What launcher? If you're using Silverscreen (or others), you can
just send the database.. in Silverscreen, you list mode, expand the
databases under the application, and beam DatebookDB...


Unfortunately, I'm just using the standard launcher. That was what I tried
first, but Palm has the standard databases "locked" so they cannot be
beamed. Is there freeware, or a demo that might do this? I looked at Filez,
but that showed the locked files also. Thanks again.


Scott
4252

From: smasters@a...
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 8:34pm
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic)

 
Jeff wrote:
In general, its like this:

           1) Uninstall old palm desktop
           2) Install new one (ideally, to same place; install the Clie
stuff
into your Handspring directory, if you had a Visor, for example)
           3) When asked, do not create a new user.. pick the old user!
           4) Restoration brings back everything


The key here for anyone in this situation is that Palm.exe goes in the same
place. Sony puts it in a "sony handheld" folder. Moving the .bak and .dat
files into the new Sony folders puts everything back in the right place.
Thanks a heap Jeff. This is good to know.

Scott
4253

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 9:55pm
Subject: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:
> 
> 	So the file did not actully get deleted. Weird. Try deleting 
it
> again.. sometimes if a file is "funny" the OS takes a couple 
deletions
> before it actually disappears.
> 

Okay, it's time for me to 'fess up and admit to what we call an ID-
ten-t error (read ID10T) here at work.

I'm using the TOC approach I've seen discussed here to keep my files 
and info organized.  To satisfy my need for order, I keep files 
assigned to 1 of 3 categories; 

1. MASTER (contains a simple list which links to files in #2 & #3)
2. Datafiles_Pers (contains all my personal lists)
3. Datafiles_Work (...)

When the DT to HH load occurred, it dropped the DT file into 
Category 'Unfiled'.

In short, it's been there all along.  Ooops !

On the plus side, it forced me to learn a bit about the 'lastsync' 
file.  Any tidbits of info for users that you can pass along about 
this file ?
4254

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:03pm
Subject: Re: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> On the plus side, it forced me to learn a bit about the 'lastsync' 
> file.  Any tidbits of info for users that you can pass along about 
> this file ?

	Nope; if you look at it, you're on your own. You can ask me
questions, but I can and will change the stuff in there at will :) The
obvious errors all begin with # ERROR. The rest of it is trace logic..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4255

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:11pm
Subject: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:
> 
> > On the plus side, it forced me to learn a bit about 
the 'lastsync' 
> > file.  Any tidbits of info for users that you can pass along 
about 
> > this file ?
> 
> 	Nope; if you look at it, you're on your own. You can ask me
> questions, but I can and will change the stuff in there at will :) 
The
> obvious errors all begin with # ERROR. The rest of it is trace 
logic..
> 
> 		jeff
> 

No problems from me on that, I'll be like a kid in a china shop - 
look but don't touch.

Now that you've mentioned # ERROR's, I just happen to have one in the 
latest synch attempt.  The filename '2Days' is the original one I 
played with and somehow corrupted.

I don't need the file anymore, it was recovered from an older DT 
copy.  Does this error indicate it's sitting on the HH taking up 
space ?

# ShadP-2Days: Copy from handheld to desktop.
#   Will read HH to internal list.
#   ERROR: List doesn't appear to have a header! Resave!
#   SKIPPING: Sync request flag not set. (43 recs)
4256

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 10:25pm
Subject: Re: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> No problems from me on that, I'll be like a kid in a china shop - 
> look but don't touch.

	You can touch.. its a "Write only" file.. the conduit rewrites it
each time, with a dump of its logic as it goes.

> Now that you've mentioned # ERROR's, I just happen to have one in the 
> latest synch attempt.  The filename '2Days' is the original one I 
> played with and somehow corrupted.
> 
> I don't need the file anymore, it was recovered from an older DT 
> copy.  Does this error indicate it's sitting on the HH taking up 
> space ?

	Yep; if you'd deleted it, it would be gone and thus Shadow
wouldn't know it existed. Since it is listed here, you know it was found
on the handheld.

	The header error suggests you had a crash in the conduit earlier,
at an inopportune time, leaving the header mushed. The data is still inthe
list, but Shadow is protecting the list by not going near it. (In the
future, I hope to have an auto-recovery mode, to repair this sort of
thing)

		jeff

> # ShadP-2Days: Copy from handheld to desktop.
> #   Will read HH to internal list.
> #   ERROR: List doesn't appear to have a header! Resave!
> #   SKIPPING: Sync request flag not set. (43 recs)

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4257

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:07pm
Subject: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:
> 
> > 
> > I don't need the file anymore, it was recovered from an older DT 
> > copy.  Does this error indicate it's sitting on the HH taking up 
> > space ?
> 
> 	Yep; if you'd deleted it, it would be gone and thus Shadow
> wouldn't know it existed. Since it is listed here, you know it was 
found
> on the handheld.
> 
> 	The header error suggests you had a crash in the conduit 
earlier,
> at an inopportune time, leaving the header mushed. The data is 
still inthe
> list, but Shadow is protecting the list by not going near it. (In 
the
> future, I hope to have an auto-recovery mode, to repair this sort of
> thing)
> 

That leaves me in a bit of a quandary, the file is still on the HH 
but I get a 'Bad Load' message when I attempt to open it.  When I try 
to delete it, the process produces the empty, unnamed file I referred 
to earlier.  Although I can delete the unnamed file, the original 
file remains.

Any way around this other than starting from scratch ?
i.e. 
- back up all my files
- delete SP and all files from HH
- reinstalling SP to the HH
- then reloading all my saved files back to the HH

If there was an icon for crossed fingers, I'd have put it here...
4258

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:21pm
Subject: Re: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> That leaves me in a bit of a quandary, the file is still on the HH 
> but I get a 'Bad Load' message when I attempt to open it.  When I try 
> to delete it, the process produces the empty, unnamed file I referred 
> to earlier.  Although I can delete the unnamed file, the original 
> file remains.

	Doesn't sound right; the file either deletes or it doesn't. It
doesn't spawn other files..

	Make sure you hit delete, and hit no to the various boxes (just to
be safe), and the file should go away.

> Any way around this other than starting from scratch ?

	If you have a filer manager or good launcher, you should be able
to wipe the file; Shadow files are all separate files on your handheld, so
you could use Z'Catalog, Silver Screen's file view, FileFox, MyFile, or
others to wipe the file out.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4259

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:21pm
Subject: Testing SP HH with Palm OS Emulator (POSE)

 
Jeff,

A seperate post asked if it was possible to synch SP to 2 machines; 
e.g. home and work.  

I've been curious if it's possible to get SP to work with the Palm OS 
emulator.  

I'd love to test features in beta releases and make sure the features 
I'm relying on are unaffected, but I can't risk having my handheld 
(and SP !) go south on me in the process.  SP is quickly becoming 
mission-critical for me.

Using POSE would help out, but to get it to work with SP DT, it 
requires a license. (Maybe I'm thinking too big ? and need to scale 
this back to consider testing just the SP HH).

What are your thoughts on this ?
4260

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:30pm
Subject: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:
> 
> 
> 	Make sure you hit delete, and hit no to the various boxes 
(just to
> be safe), and the file should go away.
> 

Hmm...works.

Answering No to remove links, then No to remove appended origin info 
deletes both files successfully.  Anything funny in the logic for 
these 2 steps ?


> 	If you have a filer manager or good launcher, you should be 
able
> to wipe the file; Shadow files are all separate files on your 
handheld, so
> you could use Z'Catalog, Silver Screen's file view, FileFox, 
MyFile, or
> others to wipe the file out.
> 


I'll check into these.  With exception of SP, I'm still running all 
shrink-wrapped applications.
4261

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:32pm
Subject: Re: Testing SP HH with Palm OS Emulator (POSE)

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> I've been curious if it's possible to get SP to work with the Palm OS 
> emulator.  

	Sure, of course. Thats how it (and probably every other) Palm OS
application is developed. (And then it is of course tested on various real
units, before it goes to Alpha)

> I'd love to test features in beta releases and make sure the features
> I'm relying on are unaffected, but I can't risk having my handheld
> (and SP !) go south on me in the process.  SP is quickly becoming
> mission-critical for me.

	Beta's have already been through Alpha testing, usually for a long
long time. (At least weeks, but usually a month or two). Alphas are where
its risky, and of the hundred or more alphas we've been through, only 1 or
2 have ever had severe annoyances.. since alphas have already been through
at least preliminary testing by me, and any caveats and watch-outs are
listed in the alpha announcement. You needn't worry too much :)

> Using POSE would help out, but to get it to work with SP DT, it
> requires a license. (Maybe I'm thinking too big ? and need to scale
> this back to consider testing just the SP HH).

	It is not advisable to sync the emu to your desktop, unless you
know what you're doing. (ie: Sync to the emu, and then sync to your
handheld. That means you're keeping the emulator with sensible correct
data and not screwing around, resetting it at the wrong times, killing it
off, etc. The emu also crashes fairly frequently, and it is not a perfect
emulation)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4262

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:33pm
Subject: Re: Re: Difficulties restoring a file from Desktop

 
On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> Answering No to remove links, then No to remove appended origin info 
> deletes both files successfully.  Anything funny in the logic for 
> these 2 steps ?

	If a file is really messed up when they get to it, it can confuse
them.

> I'll check into these.  With exception of SP, I'm still running all 
> shrink-wrapped applications.

	Sadly, the built in launcher cannot delete individual files except
for applications :/

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4263

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Fri Feb 22, 2002 11:47pm
Subject: Re: Testing SP HH with Palm OS Emulator (POSE)

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:
> 
> > I've been curious if it's possible to get SP to work with the 
Palm OS 
> > emulator.  
> 
> 	Sure, of course. Thats how it (and probably every other) Palm 
OS
> application is developed. (And then it is of course tested on 
various real
> units, before it goes to Alpha)
> 

Yeah, makes sense, kind of hard to program with a stylus and the mini-
keyboard.  :P

> 
> 	It is not advisable to sync the emu to your desktop, unless 
you
> know what you're doing. (ie: Sync to the emu, and then sync to your
> handheld. That means you're keeping the emulator with sensible 
correct
> data and not screwing around, resetting it at the wrong times, 
killing it
> off, etc. The emu also crashes fairly frequently, and it is not a 
perfect
> emulation)
> 

I see what you mean.

I was thinking of keeping my actual HH completely out of the picture, 
though and work exclusively with SP on the emu.  I've got access to 
some testing software that lets me capture & playback keystrokes, 
mouse movements and the like.  On some sleepless night in the future 
I thought I'd see if it worked on the emulator.

Cheers for now, gotta run.

Thanks for entertaining my silly questions, I know you've got other 
pressing matters.
4264

From: Tom & Christiane Moughan  <tommoughan@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 1:13am
Subject: Re: HELP! (somewhat off topic) change extension to ABA

 
Scott.

Just change the .BAK extension on address.bak to address.ABA, open the palm
desktop to the address section.  Then select File> Import, find the address.ABA
file and select it.
The addresses will be imported...


The same approach can be used to import all the other sections to your new
desktop/user name.

For datebook, the new extension is .DBA, changing datebook.bak
For Memopad, the extention should be .MPA, changing memopad.bak
For the TO DOs, the extension should be .TBA, changing todo.bak

>> Tom
     }}}
   __{{{__       /\   /\
  | o   o |\       o o
  |   V   | |     ==T==
  | }---{ |/
  \_______/

----- Original Message -----
From: "sdm42us" <smasters@a...>
To: <shadow-discuss@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, February 22, 2002 12:41 PM
Subject: [shadow-discuss] HELP! (somewhat off topic)


: Okay,
: I just changed from an M100 to a Clie T415. I had to reinstall Palm
: Desktop to get the hotsync to work. I've got most everything back on
: the T415, but how do i get the main database records back in? If I
: look at Palm\Master\Address, I can see that the records are in
: Address.bak, but how do I get it into Palm desktop and sync it to my
: Clie? Thanks for the help.
:
: Scott
:
:
:
: To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
: shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
:
:
:
: Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
:
:
4265

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 6:45am
Subject: [OT] Re: Todo import feature

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., oooieoo@k... wrote:
> Didn't the GTD guru, David Allen have something to do with
Actioneer's 
> beginnings? For what it's worth, I think how you work would
determine 
> whether Actioneer "flies in the face" of GTD, or not. For me, it's a
step 
> above the "dumping ground" I was using before. My dumping ground
could be 
> likened to a Palmtop "Inbox." Now it's just an inbox that's a lot
more 
> usable on the fly. When I've had a chance to sit down and review
what's 
> what, I can then take the time to see what I need to do next, or
save 
> everything for a larger review at the end of the day.
> 
> Nancy
> 
<snip>

I can definitely feel for that.  I started much the same way. 
Unfortuantely, I've come to realize that my situation is not the
general one that David intended his plan for, my places are much more,
well, essoteric than ones he talks about.  I've come to realize that
simple "dumping" doesn't work, you can misplace the todo when the
places are not strictly physical if you let Actioneer try to make the
decision.

I find I spend less time in review each day if I do the sorting at the
time priority, date/time and resource information is available to me.
 At review time, I have to either have written it down in the todo
note, or remember it (big no no that last one!).  So if I had to make
note of it why not use the tool that lets you make note of disparate
information easily.

With Actioneer I have to:

(1) write down more at request time.
(2) make sense of those notes at review time.
(3) assign priorty, decide "hard"/"soft" todo status
(4) enter the information into DBK4 (usually *correct* the information)

With DBK4 I only do steps 3 and 4 at "request time".

At review time all I have to do is check that I made the right
decisions on the fly and set appointment times for "hard" Todos (if I
did not already).

Ok, so maybe it doesn't "fly in the face" of GTD, but to me it just
doesn't "add up".  Why burden myself with writing all the details out
essentially long hand only to transcribe later.  With DBK4 I set it
and forget it, knowing its got the right information in the right
place.  With Actioneer, I always wonder "did I write enough".  All too
often I found myself at review time wondering, "did I mean what I
wrote?". And isn't that the point, to "set it and forget it", get it
*out* of your mind.

I could probably go on with a few more things, but for the sake of the
rest of the Shadow group, let's take it off line or over to the GTD
group.  That's if you really *want* to hear what I have to say...

And, BTW, yes I believe David has substantial interest in the company
producing Actioneer (so what do you *expect* him to say?).  I've been
called a guru on many occassions and all I can tell you is... there's
no such thing!  Question *Everything*!

Ken
4266

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 7:11am
Subject: [OT] Re: Todo import feature

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Tim McPike <tim@t...> wrote:
> 
> --- kenclatham <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > Actioneer separates these two activities, when in essence the
> > information and its categorization generally come from the same source
> > and are done in the same "place" (@Palm, if you will).  For me, its
> > @Datebk4!  Hit New, Todo and I'm there... although you may want to
> > look at SmartInput, which lets you set attribution *and* distribute to
> > other apps...
> 
> Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, I think Actioneer handles @place
automatically.
>  I have a pretty thorough keyword list set up in Actioneer that
automatically
> plugs in my Places (categories), e.g. "get milk" gets put in ToDo at
"Errands"
> by Actioneer because of the "get" keyword.
> 

<major snip>

Oh, I didn't say it didn't.  Or, at least, that's the theory.  But AI
it isn't!

My places are much more difficult to discern than that, most of them
focus around work, like @codereview, @documentation, @conference,
@coding, @taskreview.  I do this because I never really go many
places, its all at my desk.  I judge "places" as the set of resources
I have available and the mindset I have to be in to do the job.  I
wear several "hats" at work and wearing any two at the same time is
essentially the same as being in two places at the same time...it
doesn't work.

I essentially ended up having to remember certain "key" words to put
into the text so that Actioneer would put it in the right place.  This
caused stress, stress increases errors, errors increase review time.

I discovered that anything I wanted to write into Actioneer already
had a place in DBK4, and it was easier to enter to boot!  As I hinted
at in another thread, I was either overworking my mind trying to enter
things so Actioneer would do the "right" thing, or I was spending
review time cleaning up the mess.

So in response to your example "get milk".  What if I'm a milkman? I
can't connect "milk" to @drivehome only (that's my place for it). 
Basically, I found myself wondering all the time if Actioneer did the
right thing (~40% were usually in error).  This is exactly against the
whole premise of GTD, to get things *off* your mind, stay clear headed!

Let's either take this offline, over to the GTD group or drop it.  I
don't want to take up a lot of SP space with this....

Ken
4268

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 7:35am
Subject: Re: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Feb 2002, kenclatham wrote:
> 
> > Maybe this holds the answer to the "does the item count for %age"
> > question.
> > 
> > What if you add an option (simple checkbox) to check on items if you
> > wanted it excluded from %age calculation.  Maybe even a way to set the
> > defaults for each item type, either globally or per list?
> > 
> > That way there'd be no contradiction between "not showing" and "not
> > counted".  Especially in light of the above...
> > 
> > Or is this the same thing as a weight of zero?  hmmmmm
> 
> 	Thats interesting.
> 
> 	So a rule of..
> 
> 	If it displays a checkbox or %age then it counts towards %age,
> unless its weight is zero (natch).
> 
> 		jeff
> 

Actually, I was thinking that weight would, in fact, *be* the switch
that turns on or off the inclusion of %age complete into the parent
summary.

Wouldn't a zero weight mean that the item wasn't taken into the
calculation at all?  That way including/excluding items in the parent
total would be independent of the display.

I would understand if you wanted to keep the display of fields on the
list equivalent to their inclusion in the parent summary, just because
it might make the whole thing more intuitive to most users.

On the other hand you'd be limiting any future implementation of
custom fields (and summaries?) to those that could fit on the screen....

Rough choice...

Maybe "novice" and "expert" modes?

Sounds like a *lot* of work to me!
(but on the other hand it also sounds like the old Geoworks GUI, which
I liked a lot...to bad its all but dead...)


Ken
4269

From: >> F_Fast Eddie >>  <f_faste@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 3:14pm
Subject: Re: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
How about suppressing as you do today by current type, then add a button
that pops a dialog with everything in editable fields?

- Same button on every detail screen (could be small)
- Same dialog  box for every type
- No option setting required

Gives the causal user only what's needed for a given type.  Gives the power
user quick access to all attributes any time.

...ed



_________________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
4270

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 3:27pm
Subject: Re: New poll for shadow-discuss

 
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, >> F_Fast Eddie >> wrote:

> How about suppressing as you do today by current type, then add a button
> that pops a dialog with everything in editable fields?
> 
> - Same button on every detail screen (could be small)
> - Same dialog  box for every type
> - No option setting required
> 
> Gives the causal user only what's needed for a given type.  Gives the power
> user quick access to all attributes any time.

	.. but requires an extra tap, and we've already got enough
screens, I think..

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4271

From: yihyoon  <yihyoon@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 6:38pm
Subject: Help! Can't delete list

 
Hi, 

I am using Shadown Plan 2.1.  When I tried to delete a list 
named "@inbox", which is empty, answered YES to "should all links to 
this file be removed", I get the fatal alert

DataMgr.c, Line:9573, Index out of range.

Jeff, can you help?

Aemon
4272

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 8:05pm
Subject: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
Hi Ken,

Based on the info below, am I just out of luck w/ your program?  Any 
ideas, or should I just drop it and find another outliner?

Thanks,

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> I don't think I am clearly explaining the problem.  Sorry for the 
> confusion.  Let me try again. :-)
> 
> 1 - In Datebk4 or built-in ToDo app, create a todo called "Test" 
> dated today, with priority 1.
> 
> 2 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will show "Test" 
> along with any other todos of priority 1 or 2 in the current week.
> 
> 3 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
priority 
> of "Test" from 1 to 3.
> 
> 4 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *not* 
> show item "Test" but will only show those items still with priority 
1 
> or 2.
> 
> 5 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
priority 
> of "Test" back to 1 or 2.
> 
> 6 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *show* 
> item "Test" again.
> 
> I am using a Sony Clie n760 w/ OS 4.1, Datebk4 V-5.0a, pJ (latest 
> beta), and Shadow 2.1.0.  However, I see the exact same behavior 
> using the built-in ToDo app instead of Datebk4.
> 
> Hope that is a bit clearer.
> 
> Dave
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> 
> > Can I pop in and ask a question?  (oops, already did! :) )
> > 
> > Are your non-priority 1 tasks dated?
> > 
> > Jeff,
> > 
> > I was playing around to see if I could recreate this situation.  I
> > could only get the item to *not* show up when it was undated.  
> Which,
> > unfortunately, seems to mean that there is a bug in the "undated"
> > checkbox on the "New From" screen.
> > 
> > Ken  (just my 2 cents...)
4273

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 8:07pm
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Jeff M)

 
Oops, I meant Jeff... :-)

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> Hi Jeff,
> 
> Based on the info below, am I just out of luck w/ your program?  
Any 
> ideas, or should I just drop it and find another outliner?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Dave
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> > I don't think I am clearly explaining the problem.  Sorry for the 
> > confusion.  Let me try again. :-)
> > 
> > 1 - In Datebk4 or built-in ToDo app, create a todo called "Test" 
> > dated today, with priority 1.
> > 
> > 2 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will 
show "Test" 
> > along with any other todos of priority 1 or 2 in the current week.
> > 
> > 3 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
> priority 
> > of "Test" from 1 to 3.
> > 
> > 4 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *not* 
> > show item "Test" but will only show those items still with 
priority 
> 1 
> > or 2.
> > 
> > 5 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
> priority 
> > of "Test" back to 1 or 2.
> > 
> > 6 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now 
*show* 
> > item "Test" again.
> > 
> > I am using a Sony Clie n760 w/ OS 4.1, Datebk4 V-5.0a, pJ (latest 
> > beta), and Shadow 2.1.0.  However, I see the exact same behavior 
> > using the built-in ToDo app instead of Datebk4.
> > 
> > Hope that is a bit clearer.
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > > Can I pop in and ask a question?  (oops, already did! :) )
> > > 
> > > Are your non-priority 1 tasks dated?
> > > 
> > > Jeff,
> > > 
> > > I was playing around to see if I could recreate this 
situation.  I
> > > could only get the item to *not* show up when it was undated.  
> > Which,
> > > unfortunately, seems to mean that there is a bug in 
the "undated"
> > > checkbox on the "New From" screen.
> > > 
> > > Ken  (just my 2 cents...)
4274

From: rvanderwoning  <rvanderwoning@y...>
Date: Sat Feb 23, 2002 9:56pm
Subject: More New From problems

 
Jeff,

I just created a priority 3 todo item, due 2/25/02 which I 
subsequently tried to import into Shadow using the New From dialog. I 
used the Pick Week button to select next week (which has 2/25/02 in 
it) but coming back to the New From dialog, the item didn't show. 
Also, the title said "New from 3/3/02". I then used Pick Week to 
select next week a second time, and only then I saw the item and did 
the title say "New from 2/25/02".

Also, New From still has that odd cycling problem I reported a while 
back. If I use Pick Week to select the same week a couple of times, 
the date in the title cycles through all days of that particular 
week. In this case, selecting next week several times would 
produce "New from 2/25/02", "New from 2/26/02", "New from 
2/27/02", ... "New from 3/3/02".

BTW, when I cycled through to "3/3/02", the todo item disappeared 
again. Could this have something to do with 3/3 being a Sunday and 
the fact that in some countries/organisations, a week starts on a 
Sunday? Maybe Shadow thinks that this is the start of the next week 
and doesn't show the todo item because of that? (FYI: I set my 
Preferences for a week starting on Monday).

Roy.
4275

From: ehmatthews2000  <e@ematthews.net>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 0:14am
Subject: Re: Digest Number 399 (Link to Address problem)

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Tue, 19 Feb 2002, Elwood Matthews wrote:
> 
> > When attempting to link address, only addresses starting with the 
Letter "A"
> > am I able to view.
> 
> 	Please don't quote the whole digest..
> 
> 	What happens when you enter a search for a different letter? 
Or if
> you attempt to scroll down?
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_

If I scroll it stops at alpa order ALOVA and the scroll arrow goes to 
the top. Any searches beyond ALOV stop at ALOV (a name in my 
addressbook. This is not the last a name in my addressbook. It 
appears to be somewhere in the middle.
4276

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 2:20am
Subject: Re: Help! Can't delete list

 
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, yihyoon wrote:

> I am using Shadown Plan 2.1.  When I tried to delete a list 
> named "@inbox", which is empty, answered YES to "should all links to 
> this file be removed", I get the fatal alert
> 
> DataMgr.c, Line:9573, Index out of range.

	Likely means one of the files is a little older than others
(created with an older shadow, from way back), and needs
refreshing. (ie: Open your files, change *something*, then close them,
causes them to be updated). You could just answer no to the dialogs and
it'll delete no problem.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4277

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 2:24am
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:

> Based on the info below, am I just out of luck w/ your program?  Any 
> ideas, or should I just drop it and find another outliner?

	I'm still trying to nail down whats going on here; as far as I
know, this is a very rare problem.. in that, only one person is reporting
it. I suspect it may have to do with the settings in those other programs,
causing sorting oddities for Shadow trying to find the correct data. Rest
assurred, it'll be fixed if its Shadows error. I'm also expecting very
fgew will have this same problem, since I don't hear about it.

		jeff

> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Dave
> 
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "dgselig" <dgselig@y...> wrote:
> > I don't think I am clearly explaining the problem.  Sorry for the 
> > confusion.  Let me try again. :-)
> > 
> > 1 - In Datebk4 or built-in ToDo app, create a todo called "Test" 
> > dated today, with priority 1.
> > 
> > 2 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will show "Test" 
> > along with any other todos of priority 1 or 2 in the current week.
> > 
> > 3 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
> priority 
> > of "Test" from 1 to 3.
> > 
> > 4 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *not* 
> > show item "Test" but will only show those items still with priority 
> 1 
> > or 2.
> > 
> > 5 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the 
> priority 
> > of "Test" back to 1 or 2.
> > 
> > 6 - Start Shadow, select "New From" and the dialog will now *show* 
> > item "Test" again.
> > 
> > I am using a Sony Clie n760 w/ OS 4.1, Datebk4 V-5.0a, pJ (latest 
> > beta), and Shadow 2.1.0.  However, I see the exact same behavior 
> > using the built-in ToDo app instead of Datebk4.
> > 
> > Hope that is a bit clearer.
> > 
> > Dave
> > 
> > --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > > Can I pop in and ask a question?  (oops, already did! :) )
> > > 
> > > Are your non-priority 1 tasks dated?
> > > 
> > > Jeff,
> > > 
> > > I was playing around to see if I could recreate this situation.  I
> > > could only get the item to *not* show up when it was undated.  
> > Which,
> > > unfortunately, seems to mean that there is a bug in the "undated"
> > > checkbox on the "New From" screen.
> > > 
> > > Ken  (just my 2 cents...)
> 
> 
> 
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> shadow-discuss-unsubscribe@egroups.com
> 
>  
> 
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ 
> 
> 
> 

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4278

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 2:30am
Subject: Re: More New From problems

 
On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, rvanderwoning wrote:

> I just created a priority 3 todo item, due 2/25/02 which I 
> subsequently tried to import into Shadow using the New From dialog. I 
> used the Pick Week button to select next week (which has 2/25/02 in 
> it) but coming back to the New From dialog, the item didn't show. 
> Also, the title said "New from 3/3/02". I then used Pick Week to 
> select next week a second time, and only then I saw the item and did 
> the title say "New from 2/25/02".

	Did you pick the wrong week by mistake? Thats an OS dialog and it
can be very fussy if you tap and drag or the like. It returns the date, so
I can't do much about it.

> Also, New From still has that odd cycling problem I reported a while
> back. If I use Pick Week to select the same week a couple of times,
> the date in the title cycles through all days of that particular week.
> In this case, selecting next week several times would produce "New
> from 2/25/02", "New from 2/26/02", "New from 2/27/02", ... "New from
> 3/3/02".

	Again, likely soethign I can't do much about. I'll check it
though.. could be causing problems for people, so if I can fix it, I'll do
it. I believe this is a documented feature of the OS.

> BTW, when I cycled through to "3/3/02", the todo item disappeared 
> again. Could this have something to do with 3/3 being a Sunday and 
> the fact that in some countries/organisations, a week starts on a 
> Sunday? Maybe Shadow thinks that this is the start of the next week 
> and doesn't show the todo item because of that? (FYI: I set my 
> Preferences for a week starting on Monday).

	Shadow starts a week on Sunday, I believe. Woudl that cause your
issue of the missing item?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4279

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 2:33am
Subject: Re: Re: Digest Number 399 (Link to Address problem)

 
On Sun, 24 Feb 2002, ehmatthews2000 wrote:

> > > When attempting to link address, only addresses starting with the 
> Letter "A"
> > > am I able to view.
> > 
> > 	What happens when you enter a search for a different letter? 
> Or if
> > you attempt to scroll down?
> > 
> 
> If I scroll it stops at alpa order ALOVA and the scroll arrow goes to 
> the top. Any searches beyond ALOV stop at ALOV (a name in my 
> addressbook. This is not the last a name in my addressbook. It 
> appears to be somewhere in the middle.

	In the Address Book (the one you use), how do you have things
sorted and named? (ie: Company Name + LastName, or Last + First, etc). 

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4280

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 3:16am
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
At 12:05 PM 02/23/2002, Dave wrote:
>Based on the info below, am I just out of luck w/ your program?  Any
>ideas, or should I just drop it and find another outliner?

Dave, I've tried to recreate your problem a few times now, and all of my 
prioritized items show up just fine. I got to thinking about something 
else, though. I know that in step #5 you wrote:

"5 - Exit Shadow and go back to ToDo or Datebk4.  Change the priority"

This would indicate that you've tried this exercise from the ToDo program, 
but I'm wondering if it's usually DateBk4 you're working from. The reason 
I'm asking is because I remember something I learned a long time ago about 
DateBk4 (v.3 at the time)-- in order to get things to update, you had to at 
least open the ToDo program, if nothing else. In other words, it didn't 
matter if you did anything within the program, you just had to open it. 
Afterwards, DateBk3 would update, too. I don't know that this is the case 
anymore, but I wonder if it would be worth trying.

Also, check your other DateBk4 options-- maybe there's something in there 
which would account for the trouble. You might also ask CESD if it sounds 
like the problem is from DateBk's end of things. He's pretty cool about 
this stuff and is the type to want to know about it, if it turns out to be 
the case.

For what it's worth, I tried to recreate the problem using both my Vx and 
my boss's new 615C with the 4.1 OS. "New From" worked great on both.

Nancy
4281

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 8:49am
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> On Sat, 23 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:
> 
> > Based on the info below, am I just out of luck w/ your program? 
Any 
> > ideas, or should I just drop it and find another outliner?
> 
> 	I'm still trying to nail down whats going on here; as far as I
> know, this is a very rare problem.. in that, only one person is
reporting
> it. I suspect it may have to do with the settings in those other
programs,
> causing sorting oddities for Shadow trying to find the correct data.
Rest
> assurred, it'll be fixed if its Shadows error. I'm also expecting
very
> fgew will have this same problem, since I don't hear about it.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
<snip>

Jeff,

I'm afraid I have to confirm this problem...it's there alright.

Set your system Prefs to "Week starts: Monday"  (under Formats)

Then go to New From: and pick a this week. Each time you select the
same week, the date at the top of "New From" shifts a day forward. 
When it gets to the date of the Sunday that ends the week it cycles
back to the date of the Monday that starts the week.

I tried it today (being Sunday) and on the week ending today nothing
showed up until I cycled the date to the 24 th (by repeatedly picking
"this" week), then everything showed up.

Note that when I first enter the New From screen the date at the top
is 2/24/02 (today) and all items show up.  When I go and pick the
week, the New From screen shows 2/18/02 and nothing shows up (unless I
check "completed").  For every successive pick the date "moves".

It looks as though you are selecting the proper week IF the week
started on Sunday, but it doesn't look as though you have the option
of disagreeing with a System option!

(afterthought, does this only happen when *today* is Sunday?)

As for my previous observation...

I still say I can not get undated Todos to show up no matter what I
set or unset.  Now mind you I *never* use undated ToDos, so I guess it
is a rare problem, if everyone else is like me....

But, hey, if you *say* you can do it.... :)


Ken
4282

From: oooieoo@k...
Date: Sun Feb 24, 2002 8:56am
Subject: Re: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
At 12:49 AM 02/24/2002, Ken wrote:
>I still say I can not get undated Todos to show up no matter what I
>set or unset.  Now mind you I *never* use undated ToDos, so I guess it
>is a rare problem, if everyone else is like me....
>
>But, hey, if you *say* you can do it.... :)

... and I *always* use undated ToDos and they all show up. Go figure.

Nancy
4283

From: Tim McPike  <tim@t...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 0:58am
Subject: Re: [OT] Re: Todo import feature

 
--- kenclatham <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Tim McPike <tim@t...> wrote:
> > 
> > Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, I think Actioneer handles @place
> automatically.

> <major snip>
> 

> So in response to your example "get milk".  What if I'm a milkman? I

> Let's either take this offline, over to the GTD group or drop it.  I
> don't want to take up a lot of SP space with this....
> 
> Ken

No need.  I see your point, and I agree with you.  Thanks Ken.

=====
************
Tim McPike
tim@t...

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Sports - Coverage of the 2002 Olympic Games
http://sports.yahoo.com
4284

From: kenclatham  <clatham1@t...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:30am
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., oooieoo@k... wrote:
> At 12:49 AM 02/24/2002, Ken wrote:
> >I still say I can not get undated Todos to show up no matter what I
> >set or unset.  Now mind you I *never* use undated ToDos, so I guess it
> >is a rare problem, if everyone else is like me....
> >
> >But, hey, if you *say* you can do it.... :)
> 
> ... and I *always* use undated ToDos and they all show up. Go figure.
> 
> Nancy

OoooK, I guess I'll have to do some more playing around, to see if I
can get them to show up!  I *hate* strange stuff like this...

Ken
4285

From: rvanderwoning  <rvanderwoning@y...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 10:22am
Subject: Re: More New From problems

 
> 	Did you pick the wrong week by mistake? Thats an OS
> dialog and it can be very fussy if you tap and drag or the like.
> It returns the date, so I can't do much about it.

I repeated this test at least half a dozen times and the results were 
consistent. Perhaps we're looking at an OS bug here? (Palm m505, OS 
4.0)

> > Also, New From still has that odd cycling problem I reported a
> > while back. If I use Pick Week to select the same week a couple
> > of times, the date in the title cycles through all days of that
> > particular week. In this case, selecting next week several
> > times would produce "New from 2/25/02", "New from 2/26/02",
> > "New from 2/27/02", ... "New from 3/3/02".
> 
> 	Again, likely soethign I can't do much about. I'll check it
> though.. could be causing problems for people, so if I can fix
> it, I'll do it. I believe this is a documented feature of the OS.

It's not so much a problem as such, but when combined with the issue 
of items not appearing which seems to be related to this phenomenon, 
it can be confusing.

> 	Shadow starts a week on Sunday, I believe. Woudl that
> cause your issue of the missing item?

That's what I was asking you. :) But yes, I do believe that this 
could be the cause of the problem.

There is an option in the system preferences under Formats for this. 
Shouldn't Shadow adhere to that instead of assuming that everyone 
starts their week on Sunday?

BTW, I never really understood why it is even an option to have a 
week start on Sunday. Isn't this the infamous seventh day of the 
world's creation in the Bible? And isn't Sunday part of the weekEND? 
Don't (most) people start working again on a Monday? Does anyone know 
where this "week starts on Sunday" thing comes from?

Roy.
4286

From: dgselig  <dgselig@y...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:00pm
Subject: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
Just to add my data point:

If I add an undated ToDo, it will only show up in the "New From" list 
if it is priority 1 or 2.  But it does show up if I set to 1 or 2.  
Change it to 3 and it disappears.

Dave

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "kenclatham" <clatham1@t...> wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., oooieoo@k... wrote:
> > At 12:49 AM 02/24/2002, Ken wrote:
> > >I still say I can not get undated Todos to show up no matter 
what I
> > >set or unset.  Now mind you I *never* use undated ToDos, so I 
guess it
> > >is a rare problem, if everyone else is like me....
> > >
> > >But, hey, if you *say* you can do it.... :)
> > 
> > ... and I *always* use undated ToDos and they all show up. Go 
figure.
> > 
> > Nancy
> 
> OoooK, I guess I'll have to do some more playing around, to see if I
> can get them to show up!  I *hate* strange stuff like this...
> 
> Ken
4287

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:28pm
Subject: Re: Re: More New From problems

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, rvanderwoning wrote:

> There is an option in the system preferences under Formats for this. 
> Shouldn't Shadow adhere to that instead of assuming that everyone 
> starts their week on Sunday?

	Yes :)

	I've got it near the top of my list of things to do :)

> BTW, I never really understood why it is even an option to have a week
> start on Sunday. Isn't this the infamous seventh day of the world's
> creation in the Bible? And isn't Sunday part of the weekEND?  Don't
> (most) people start working again on a Monday? Does anyone know where
> this "week starts on Sunday" thing comes from?

	I dunno; its always been spoken of as Saturday is the week end and
Sunday is the week begin, around here. You think of Sat+Sun as a group,
but they just so happen to loop and sit side by side. The work week begins
on Monday for most people, but the work week is not related to the
calendar week, since the calendar preceeds it :) (But since I was a kid, I
always figured the week should begin Monday..)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4288

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:29pm
Subject: Re: Re: P3-P5 ToDo problem (Ken)

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, dgselig wrote:

> Just to add my data point:
> 
> If I add an undated ToDo, it will only show up in the "New From" list 
> if it is priority 1 or 2.  But it does show up if I set to 1 or 2.  
> Change it to 3 and it disappears.

	I'll be looking into it. Very whacky.

	Which ToDo program?

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4289

From: Jacob Share  <jshare@i...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:41pm
Subject: Re: Re: More New From problems

 
> BTW, I never really understood why it is even an option to have a week
> start on Sunday. Isn't this the infamous seventh day of the world's
> creation in the Bible? And isn't Sunday part of the weekEND?  Don't
> (most) people start working again on a Monday? Does anyone know where
> this "week starts on Sunday" thing comes from?

Here in Israel, the work week is Sunday to Thursday so personally I'm glad that the "week starts on Sunday" option exists. Also, the Hebrew translation for Sunday is "first day".

Jacob


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
4290

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:44pm
Subject: Re: Future plans to resolve AppLauncher / Goto problem ?

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "arskillings72212" <bob.skillings@A...> 
wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 
> > 	Can you reproduce the goto/launcher problem?
> 
> I'll work on recreating it and get a return post back to you ASAP - 
> course, now it won't happen :)

Jeff,

I've tried all I can do to get this problem to happen again and 
failed - the 'Return to Shadow goto' problem isn't there for my unit 
anymore.

Sorry for running us down this empty fox hole but thanks for your 
excellent support.
4291

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 1:48pm
Subject: Re: Future plans to resolve AppLauncher / Goto problem ?

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "arskillings72212" <bob.skillings@A...> 
wrote:
> --- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Kevin Giberson" <kevin@g...> wrote:
> > If spacing out means losing word space to the left, I vote no.  
> 
> If moving to the left is the answer, I agree with Kevin - don't do 
> it.  The amount of space available for text is limited, keep what 
> you've got.
> 
> What I need is to be able to see the date unobscured.


Jeff,

I've noticed the traffic on this topic is pretty low (and the problem 
is admittedly minor), have you any thoughts on what to do with this ?
4292

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:15pm
Subject: Force Save & Protecting Lists

 
Jeff,

Over the weekend, I was updating one of my major work-related SP 
lists.  After re-naming and re-ordering quite a few items, I added a 
few notes to the Details page and then started to add a lengthy Note 
to myself.  SP locked up on me and forced a reset, losing my data.

Since it was Saturday, I figured it was God's way of telling me to go 
outside to play with my kids and put work aside for a bit.  The data 
was easy enough to replace so no worries there.

I seem to recall you saying somewhere that SP doesn't actually write 
changes out as 'permanent' changes until you exit the SP list.  If 
that's the case, would you consider adding an option to do a 'force-
save' from inside the list ?


Also, have you had any requests to protect (ie lock-out) a list from 
changes ?  

I work on a lot of short to medium term projects (3 to 6 months) with 
similar, repetitive milestones.  When one project starts, I create a 
new list by copying and renaming a template file.  After minor 
modifications have been made to that list and agreed-upon by all 
parties, that list becomes my 'contract' for work.  

As you can imagine, changes to that list become very sensitive at 
that point.  Any chance of putting in a feature at the list level to 
lock out changes ?
4293

From: funfactorde  <FunFactor@g...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:27pm
Subject: Re: VFS/cards

 
What I'd like best (I know it might be lot of work and can might 
be done in serveral steps) is that shadow doesn't make a difference 
between the files on the card and the on in normal ram.
There could be a directory on the card (even one that has to be 
created by hand) name "/shadow/" for example *gg* that contains all 
shadow files. What I think to be important (for whatever solution) is 
that files on the card got categories (the same as in ram would be 
great) to be arranged with. Otherwise one get's lost or cannot use
the card (16MB or more space) as big storage units.

Regards,
   Stefan

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 
> 	Do you want it like this?
> 
> 	1) You hit the category popmenu in the top right of the file 
selection screen
> 
> 	2) You pick "Card"
> 
> 	3) The file listing gets updated with a list of files from the 
"Shadow Plan" directory on your card
> 
> 	4) Pick a file, and it is *copied* into Palm normal memory and 
read from there
> 
> 	5) When you save the file, it is copied back to the VFS card
> 
> 	6) when you close the list (exit that list), the "temp" file 
is removed from palm memory
> 
> 	Reading and writing directly to the card can come, but its 
much more work, so I'm debating options.
> 
> 		jeff
> 
> --
> "It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own 
micro
> circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
> sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he 
is?"
> -- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4294

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:35pm
Subject: Re: Re: Future plans to resolve AppLauncher / Goto problem ?

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> I've noticed the traffic on this topic is pretty low (and the problem 
> is admittedly minor), have you any thoughts on what to do with this ?

	Nope; My current thought is to ignore it for awhile, in favour of
working on more pressing things :)

	(VFS support almost done)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4295

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:40pm
Subject: Re: Force Save & Protecting Lists

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> I seem to recall you saying somewhere that SP doesn't actually write 
> changes out as 'permanent' changes until you exit the SP list.  If 
> that's the case, would you consider adding an option to do a 'force-
> save' from inside the list ?

	It saves when you save the list; saving the list is forced on
closing the list, or Shadow, and you can invoke it yourself already (see
[V] popmenu, Save Now, for instance. Theres also an option in the List
pulldown menu, unless I removed it :)

> Also, have you had any requests to protect (ie lock-out) a list from 
> changes ?  

	A couple, but not many. It would be some ugly work, so I'm not too
interested in it unless it becomes a big request. But right now, I'm
thinking of targetting fixes, required improvements, and some fancier
desktop stuff. (ie: VFS, highres, moving items and sorting and filtering
on the desktop, tags and custom filters on the handheld). Stop getting
into other things and regroup and nail stuff thats beenpending for awhile.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4296

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 2:43pm
Subject: Re: Re: VFS/cards

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, funfactorde wrote:

> What I'd like best (I know it might be lot of work and can might 
> be done in serveral steps) is that shadow doesn't make a difference 
> between the files on the card and the on in normal ram.
> There could be a directory on the card (even one that has to be 
> created by hand) name "/shadow/" for example *gg* that contains all 
> shadow files. What I think to be important (for whatever solution) is 
> that files on the card got categories (the same as in ram would be 
> great) to be arranged with. Otherwise one get's lost or cannot use
> the card (16MB or more space) as big storage units.

	I've currently set it up so if you have an OS 4.x or greater unit,
you get a card picker in the top of the file selection screen, where you
can pick "Internal" or a card you've got in (any number of cards can be
handled). Once you pick the card, the files are listed as appropriate.

	Opening files on a storage card copies the file to the handheldf
where it can be worked on.. this is pretty much how it is supposed to be
done with OS4.x. When you save the file, it saves to ram, and then the
file is moved over top of the cards one (unless you've yanked out the
card, there you're left with it in ram. Your problem :)

	Categories won't be supported right off.. you'll be in the card,
or in the palm. But I hope to add category support a bit down the
road. Categories aren't supported on cards at all, so I've got to build a
system for it.

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4297

From: arskillings72212  <bob.skillings@A...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 3:55pm
Subject: Re: Force Save & Protecting Lists

 
--- In shadow-discuss@y..., Jeff Mitchell <support@s...> wrote:
> 
> 	It saves when you save the list; saving the list is forced on
> closing the list, or Shadow, and you can invoke it yourself already 
(see
> [V] popmenu, Save Now, for instance. Theres also an option in the 
List
> pulldown menu, unless I removed it :)
> 

Sorry, missed reading this in the doc.  This is perfect.

> > Also, have you had any requests to protect (ie lock-out) a list 
from 
> > changes ?  
> 
> 	A couple, but not many. It would be some ugly work, so I'm 
not too
> interested in it unless it becomes a big request.

> Stop getting
> into other things and regroup and nail stuff thats beenpending for 
awhile.
> 

Not sure if I'm being scolded or not with your note.  You have an 
excellent product and a great response rate to user questions.  My 
apologies if I've taken advantage of that or asked inappropriate 
questions.
4298

From: Jeff Mitchell  <support@s...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 4:39pm
Subject: Re: Re: Force Save & Protecting Lists

 
On Mon, 25 Feb 2002, arskillings72212 wrote:

> > 	A couple, but not many. It would be some ugly work, so I'm 
> not too
> > interested in it unless it becomes a big request.
> 
> > Stop getting
> > into other things and regroup and nail stuff thats beenpending for 
> awhile.
> 
> Not sure if I'm being scolded or not with your note.  You have an 
> excellent product and a great response rate to user questions.  My 
> apologies if I've taken advantage of that or asked inappropriate 
> questions.

	No, definitely not! Inmy hurry (it was early morning :) I simply
wrote "Stop.." when I had meant "I'm hoping to stop..." (pseudo implied
fomr previous sentence). So, just a groggy morning email :)

	So to rephrase:

	I intend to hold off on getting into "new" things until existing
pending new things get finished, and we clean up a few bugs that have
cropped up of late. We need to nail down the floor before building the
house more :)

		jeff

--
"It's murder out there. You can't even travel around in your own micro
circuits without permission from 'Master Control Program'. I mean,
sending *ME* down here to play games.... Who does he calculate he is?"
-- Peter Jurasik as Crom, _Tron_
4299

From: Cindy Greene  <cindyg@c...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 5:12pm
Subject: OT - first day of week

 
Actually, Saturday is the seventh day and the Jewish Sabbath.

Sunday is the first day of the week. Early Christians chose to observe
that day as the "Lord's Day" after the resurrection of Christ, and most
Christians still do.

This quote is interesting whether or not it is completely accurate: 

"The 7-day week was introduced in Rome (where ides, nones, and calends
were the vogue) in the first century A.D. by Persian astrology fanatics,
not by Christians or Jews. The idea was that there would be a day for
the five known planets, plus the sun and the moon, making seven; this
was an ancient West Asian idea. However, when Christianity became the
official religion of the Roman empire in the time of Constantine (c. 325
A.D.), the familiar Hebrew-Christian week of 7 days, beginning on
Sunday, became conflated with the pagan week and took its place in the
Julian calendar. Thereafter, it seemed to Christians that the week Rome
now observed was seamless with the 7-day week of the Bible -- even
though its pagan roots were obvious in the names of the days: Saturn's
day, Sun's day, Moon's day. The other days take their equally pagan
names in English from a detour into Norse mythology: Tiw's day, Woden's
day, Thor's day, and Fria's day. "--
 http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~stephan/Astronomy/7day.html

Very off-topic and I apologize. For most of us, regardless of religion,
I think we are so used to seeing Sunday visually on a calendar as the
first day of the week that it is entirely appropriate for Shadow to
offer that as an option or default.

Cindy


> BTW, I never really understood why it is even an option to have a
> week start on Sunday. Isn't this the infamous seventh day of the
> world's creation in the Bible? And isn't Sunday part of the weekEND?
> Don't (most) people start working again on a Monday? Does anyone know
> where this "week starts on Sunday" thing comes from?
> 
> Roy.P
4300

From: PocketGoddess  <jen@p...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 5:26pm
Subject: RE: OT - first day of week

 
> Very off-topic and I apologize. For most of us, regardless of
religion,
> I think we are so used to seeing Sunday visually on a calendar as the
> first day of the week that it is entirely appropriate for Shadow to
> offer that as an option or default.

Very interesting stuff, but I always use Monday as the first day
myself-- splitting the weekend and having Sunday doesn't make much sense
when I'm planning.  So I would very much like to see Shadow with a "week
starts on Monday" pref for planning purposes.

Jen

----------------
PocketGoddess
http://www.pocketgoddess.com
98% Palm OS, 100% Fun!
4301

From: lcsahagun  <lcsahagun@w...>
Date: Mon Feb 25, 2002 5:51pm
Subject: Re: Clie and Handera folks!

 
what font are you using?

--- In shadow-discuss@y..., "Kevin Giberson" <kevin@g...> wrote:
> i'd agree re: Sony Clie...jog dial (screen at a time, not line at a 
time) and back button support first...jog dial is used extensively 
here.  thanks.
> kevin
> 
> 
>   ----- Original Message ----- 
>   From: Russ & Ling Nero 
>   To: shadow-discuss@y... 
>   Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2002 7:09 AM
>   Subject: Re: [shadow-discuss] Clie and Handera folks!
> 
> 
> 
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: Kenneth S. Rhee <polymath@m...>
> 
>   > Sharper icons and small high resolution fonts would be nice.
> 
>   > BTW, I've been using Lubak's fonts with Fonthack, and boy, does 
it look
>   nice.  It's better than hrfontmapper I've used in the past.
> 
>   > With the fonhack and Lubak's fonts, I think I can wait for a 
long time for
>   Clie support (i.e., it's that good).
> 
>   Agreed.  I've also been using Lubak's fonts and Shadow works 
great with it.
>   Sharper icons are nice, but I rather have support for the jog 
dial and back
>   button first.
> 
>   Ling
> 
> 
> 
> 
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
  4201-4301 of 10340  |  Previous | Next  [ First | Last ]
 
 Msg #   Date  |  Thread
Collapse Messages Using 29.6 of 512 MB (5%)


Copyright 2003 Yahoo! Inc. All rights reserved.
Privacy Policy - Terms of Service - Guidelines - Help